How The Clone Wars Saved Star Wars

[jpchewy01]

So, as many of you know, I hate the prequel trilogy with a burning passion. I grew up watching the original trilogy since I was two years old. In fact, The Phantom Menace didn't come out until I was four. My mom took me to see it in theatres and I really didn't like it all that much. I would have rather been with Luke, Han, and Leia for the hundredth time. Lightning struck twice with Attack of the Clones, easily one of the stupidest films I've ever had the misfortune of seeing on the big screen. When I saw that film, I was so uninterested that I went to the restroom (something I never do in movies, I can't interrupt the narrative) after Anakin killed the Tusken Raiders. Revenge of the Sith was a definite improvement at the time, however, like most of us, my opinion of the film only soured with time. Looking back at the Star Wars Saga, I had three films that I pretty much hated and would eventually come to wish had never been made and three fantastic films that I love to no end. I eventually just decided to ignore everything related to the prequels and focus my time and energy on the originals and OT-related EU materials, like the Thrawn trilogy and other books featuring my favourite characters. In fact, my interest in Star Wars was waning, I was beginning to lose hope that Lucasfilm would ever release anything current that was up to my standards. Mind you, I still haven't played KOTOR because of this particular episode in my life. I was a fan of the original Star Wars: Clone Wars cartoon from the guy who did Samurai Jack and considered it a crime when Lucasfilm released that awful Clone Wars movie. I thought Ahsoka was dumb, I thought the era was dumb, I was very mad. However, after hearing about how awesome The Clone Wars TV show was, I had to give it a look.

I went into TCW with immense trepidation. I really, really, really, didn't want to be disappointed by this show and I was so sure that it was going to happen anyway. But, as anyone who has seen TCW would know, I fell in love. At first, it was the incredulity of something that was related to the prequels actually being good, which quickly turned into a real appreciation for a fantastic Star Wars product. Dave Filoni managed to capture the feel of the original trilogy in perhaps the blandest era of Star Wars and turn it into something really cool. By the end of the show, I was a huge Ahsoka Tano fan and felt like I could enjoy Star Wars again. But I didn't realize the extent to which Filoni had shifted the paradigm until I began to rewatch the show. As Star Wars was consolidated into the single canon that we know now, the Skywalker story regained its position of importance in the galaxy. In fact, the only canon materials out right now all have either a Skywalker in them or a character who is heavily involved in the Skywalker story. Armed with that and the knowledge that George was trying to make Star Wars Anakin's story, I decided to rewatch TCW with a specific focus on the characterization of Ahsoka Tano, who was heavily influence by Anakin by sheer virtue of fighting a war by his side.

Ahsoka would probably know more about Anakin than anyone other than Padme because she's had time to observe him and his interactions with the rest of the Jedi Order. Ahsoka is also a free-thinker. Over the course of the war, she's had to weed out corruption on Mandalore, giving a lecture to a class of Mandalorian cadets about what it means to be the citizen of a Republic, survive on her own after being kidnapped by Trandoshan hunters, having to think way outside the box in order to save her life and the lives of the other padawan captives, and meet various characters who don't fall neatly into either faction, Separatist or Republican, like the noble pirate Hondo, frequent frenemy of the Jedi, or Lux Bonteri, the heroic Separatist. She has also witnessed the gradual shift towards empire that Palpatine is guiding after being hunted down in the Sabotage arc. By the end of the series, rather than there being "heroes on both sides", Ahsoka sees it more as villains on both sides. She realizes that not even the Jedi care about the fate of the galaxy, they are too concerned with the stability of the Republic and their place in it. Never does the Order consider any other courses of action, which will eventually lead to their demise at the hands of their own clones (WHO THEY KNEW WERE GOING TO TURN ON THEM!!!!!). Ahsoka knows that her best chance at becoming the Jedi that she is destined to be is to forge her own path, independent of either side.

Concurrently in a number of these arcs, namely the Trandoshan predators arc and the Sabotage arc, Anakin is struggling with letting go. In the Trandoshan arc, he has to accept the fact that Ahsoka's fate is in her own hands and in the Sabotage arc, he faces a similar challenge. Following Ahsoka out of the Jedi Temple after she decides not to return to the Order, Anakin reveals that he, too, wishes that he could just walk away from the Order. But Ahsoka already knows Anakin, she knows that he's been at odds with the Council a lot and that he often does things his own way. The Order doesn't appreciate this but they also don't acknowledge that this unorthodox way of doing things is what allowed Ahsoka to get out of every tight spot she's been in. The Order is so caught up in enforcing its silly rules that it has lost touch with the Will of the Force. Why do you think no one can turn into Force Ghosts any more? So Ahsoka just turns around to Anakin and says, "I know" and walks off into the sunset.

So what does this have to say about Anakin and the prophecy of the Chosen One? How has this show changed my perspective on the saga while also salvaging what it can of the ideas in the prequels? Well, firstly, it accepts the faults of the prequels. Yes, the Senate is dumb and so are the Jedi. Yes, this world is very different from the world of the Original Trilogy. Then, secondly, it provides an explanation for all of this, the Republic had lost its way at this point in time, becoming vulnerable to the influence of the Dark Side. As Barris Offee says in The Wrong Jedi, the Jedi and the clones have become an army for the Dark Side and something must be done. The slate had to be wiped clean and only one guy could take the fall like that, Anakin Skywalker. You see, it was the will of the Force for Anakin to show the galaxy a new way and, even though he lost his path along the way, in the end, he accomplished this. His son, Luke, much like Ahsoka, by the end of the OT had forged his own path as a Jedi. Though Obi-Wan and Yoda had advised him to kill Anakin, Luke realized that the only way to end this madness was with love. He refused to kill his father and, in this act, showed Vader the true Jedi way. Released from the bondage of the Dark Side, Vader turns on his former master and casts the Emperor into the abyss. By the end, the only Jedi left is Luke who is now faced with the task of rebuilding the Jedi as they should be.

So, yeah, I really liked The Clone Wars and would love to hear all of your thoughts on the show as well. Happy typing!

 

[Minuteman75]

Wow that is a lot to consider I must say. There isn't much for me to say considering what's already been stated. I really did enjoyed the series as it got better and better with each season. Some of my personal favorite things in the series was Hondo and his pirate antics, the clone troopers' arc on Umbara and the Onderon rebels.

Now I do want to bring up about Barriss at the end of the Wrong Jedi episode. While she had a point about the corruption within the Republic and Jedi Order but she was still a bloody hypocrite due to her own crimes which only added to the tragedy of the Clone Wars.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

Now I do want to bring up about Barriss at the end of the Wrong Jedi episode. While she had a point about the corruption within the Republic and Jedi Order but she was still a bloody hypocrite due to her own crimes which only added to the tragedy of the Clone Wars.

Barriss' hypocrisy was an important part of the story. Her hypocrisy was ultimately less about her than it was about Anakin and Ahsoka. Anakin came to believe many of the same things that Barriss did, but, like Barriss, he gave into the same violent behavior that he and Barriss both decried as tools of the Jedi Council. Ahsoka, who also came to believe in the corruption of the Jedi Order, did not resort to the same violence that the Jedi Council engaged in. Rather, she walked away. She set out on her own path. The same path that Anakin wanted to follow, but was too afraid to.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

There was something else that dawned on me when JP and I were talking about all of this yesterday, that being something else that I think the show salvaged. You may recall the scene in Episode II where Dooku tempts Obi-Wan in the prison cell on Geonosis, asking Obi-Wan to join him, and even using Qui-Gon's memory to try and sway Obi-Wan. One of the key lines in that scene was when Dooku said, "What if I told you that the Republic was now under the control of the Dark Lord of the Sith?" Obi-Wan denies it, saying that the Jedi would have sensed it, but Dooku tells him that the dark side is clouding the vision of the Order and that hundreds of Senators are falling under the Dark Lord's influence.

It's a cool line in and of itself, but in the context of just Episode II and Episode III, it doesn't really make any sense. It was never clear why Dooku was trying to play Obi-Wan in that prison scene.

So then it dawned on me. As it was shown in The Clone Wars, the Jedi had tunnel vision when it came to the Sith. They were so focused on finding Darth Sidious (the fact that they didn't realize it was Palpatine is dumb, but let's just go with it) that they were missing the bigger picture. And they fought the Clone Wars because the Sith, represented by Dooku, were on the Separatist side

The Geonosian prison scene is where the Jedi learn about Darth Sidious, the master that led Mace Windu to ask "Which was destroyed, the master or the apprentice?" in Episode I. That line is why the Jedi fight the Clone Wars the way they do. The Battle of Geonosis was going to happen anyway, but there was no reason for the Jedi to suit up and become generals for the entire war. They do so because they think they are fighting for the fate of the galaxy against the Sith. We see that particularly come to a head in the arc where Yoda seeks immortality, where all he is concerned with is finding Darth Sidious, and comes to learn that the Jedi had already lost the Clone Wars just by fighting in it.

And that drive to find the Dark Lord leads the Jedi Council to continue using the clone army, even after they learn that it was created by Dooku for sinister purposes. It's why they continue fighting the war even after realizing that they are caught in the web of the Sith. And most importantly, it's what led Mace Windu and the three other Jedi Masters to the Chancellor's office in Episode III - giving Sidious the perfect public justification to destroy the Jedi as traitors and declare himself, the poor, scarred victim of a Jedi rebellion, as the Emperor.

That line is key to the fall of the Jedi, and The Clone Wars is the reason why.

None of which changes the fact that the Jedi were dumb and should have been able to see that Sidious and Palpatine were the same person, but The Clone Wars was still able to salvage it.

 

[Phil]

So yeah... The Prequel Jedi were big dumb dumbs. You'd think there would be at least a few that were a bit sharper then Sidious and would have seen past his charade with little trouble...

 

[Brandon Rhea]

So yeah... The Prequel Jedi were big dumb dumbs. You'd think there would be at least a few that were a bit sharper then Sidious and would have seen past his charade with little trouble...

Something interesting was recently added to the canon. In Tarkin, by James Luceno, it was revealed that the Jedi Temple was built atop an ancient Sith shrine, and that before the Empire, no one had set foot in it for five thousand years. The reason the Jedi built their temple there was to eliminate the dark side powers that the shrine held. The Jedi thought they had succeeded, but some of the powers of the shrine continued to seep out. This shrine, in addition to the imbalance within the Force, is part of what clouded the vision of the Jedi and caused them to make poor decisions, as they were literally sitting on top of a nexus of dark side energies. So while a plot device like that should not have been needed, it is an interesting way of looking at why the Jedi acted the way they did.

The Sith shrine is also important to Sidious. After the Empire rises, Sidious converts the Jedi Temple into the Imperial Palace. So the Jedi Temple we see in the more recent versions of Return of the Jedi is actually the Imperial Palace, which is why its lights are on and looks like an actively-used building. Sidious himself doesn't spend much time ruling the government, instead letting the Ruling Council manage the daily affairs of state, but he does participate when it's essential. The rest of the time, he remains in the Sith shrine, which has been excavated.

The reason he spends his time there is because of what his overall master plan was for the galaxy. Darth Plagueis once told him that the Force can strike back, so Sidious is attempting to reshape the Force in his own design, forever eliminating the light side so it can never strike back and so the dark side can rule forever. Sidious intended to one day use Darth Vader to help him achieve that, and to coax from the Force the final secrets of the dark side. Sidious believed that success would mean he could rule the galaxy for ten thousand years. He also knew that such actions meant that there would have to be two, meaning Vader had to be included, because one would serve as bait for the dark side while the other would be his vessel. Whatever bait meant, we can assume that Sidious would be the vessel of the dark side.

Considering how Tarkin introduced the idea of Sith shrines and Rebels just introduced the idea that there are thousands of Jedi temples across the galaxy, I almost have to wonder if that's going to be a plot point somewhere down the canonical line.

 

[Latte]

All I can say in response to the OP is "Yes, I agree with all of that."

 

[Skyway]

The Prequel Jedi were dumb, but I like the prequel jedi movies and yes, I like Jar Jar. It possible I grow up in the prequels time but I rather have GCI yoda than puppet yoda even if puppet funnier.

 

[Cainhurst Crow]

So yeah... The Prequel Jedi were big dumb dumbs. You'd think there would be at least a few that were a bit sharper then Sidious and would have seen past his charade with little trouble...

Well, his charade is two fold if you think about it. 1 being that he's a kind hearted patriot doing what he does for the sake of the republic and goodness of his heart, and the other charade being that he's just a politician and nothing more.

Even if you see past his warm exterior he'd still be acting like any political power would under normal circumstances, using his authority to try and increase his influence and term leading the senate, and commuting dubious activities to sure up his power base. None of that is really "sith" activity per-say, more just the standard backroom dealings and pragmatic ambition that many who serve in the political realm have.

To go from "he's an ambitious politician trying to serve himself" to "he's the embodiment of the darkside trying to destroy the galactic republic" would be a radical notion to convince people of, and not have it sound like ludicrous hyperbole from someone trying to delegitimize a political power. As ludicrous as any of the "My opponent is evil" calls you hear in modern politics today. It's one of the reasons I think palpatines "disguise" as it were is pretty ingenious, as it allows a leeway of ambition and power consolidation with a plausible deniability, at least beyond being called a sith lord.

At least, that's my take on it.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

The Prequel Jedi were dumb, but I like the prequel jedi movies and yes, I like Jar Jar. It possible I grow up in the prequels time but I rather have GCI yoda than puppet yoda even if puppet funnier.

I didn't mind the fact that there was a CGI Yoda. I mean, a real puppet is generally more believable to a person's eye than a CGI model, since you can tell a puppet is real; and while the Episode II CGI Yoda was pretty bad, the Episode III Yoda (which was then added into Episode I to replace that really horrible puppet) was pretty good.

What I minded with Yoda was how the prequels changed his characterization. The prequel Yoda said things like "Around the survivors, a perimeter create” and "Begun the Clone Wars have," whereas the OT Yoda said things like "Wars not make one great" and "A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defense, never for attack." The prequel Yoda sat in an ivory tower on an ecumenopolis, while the OT Yoda talked about being connected to nature, and how the Force flows through you, the trees, the rocks, and everything in nature. The prequel Yoda used a lightsaber and bounced around on the walls, while the OT Yoda said that his ally was the Force and never once said anything about a lightsaber.

The reason for the discrepancy is because when George Lucas made the OT, he had a different idea about what the Jedi were like. There is a transcript of a conversation between Lucas and Lawrence Kasdan (the writer of The Empire Strikes Back, Return of the Jedi, and now The Force Awakens) in The Making of Return of the Jedi where Lucas said that there was a difference between a Jedi Master and a Jedi Knight. Yoda, Lucas said, was a Jedi Master, meaning he was a teacher of Jedi Knights, but Yoda was not a Jedi Knight. Lucas specifically said that Yoda would not go into battle, rather he trained those who did; he trained the knights who went around protecting the galaxy as guardians of peace and justice. Jedi Masters were not the same as those knights. They were sages. But when Lucas made the prequels, he changed that. The Jedi became an institutionalized Order with ranks and hierarchies. Jedi Knight and Jedi Master were no longer specializations, but ranks within an institution. Yoda at one point was a Jedi Knight, and, as we know, he was trained to use a lightsaber. And use it he did, which was part of a characterization that was different from the one in the OT, because Lucas changed his mind about what the Jedi were sometime between 1983 and 1999.

All of that would have been more acceptable to me had there been actual character development to go along with it. Instead, we go from prequel Yoda to OT Yoda like a light switch between Episode III and Episode V. In the films alone, we never saw Yoda learn any lessons that would justify why he acted differently in the OT than he did in the prequels.

That is, of course, until The Clone Wars came along. The Yoda arc in The Lost Missions is very important in that we see Yoda come to terms with the fact that the Jedi are fighting a pointless war, that they are destined to lose the war, but that eventually they will win the future. He learns lessons from Qui-Gon, and he learns that he was tunnel vision'd in trying to find Darth Sidious. We know that he will continue to learn from Qui-Gon after Episode III, so putting that together, and using the lessons that Yoda learned in the show, it gave us that bridge between the prequels and the originals that was sorely needed. Yoda's appearance in Star Wars Rebels continued that bridge.

Which goes back to the thread topic that JP choose. While that Yoda arc in The Lost Missions isn't perfect, The Clone Wars salvaged Yoda's character.

Well, his charade is two fold if you think about it. 1 being that he's a kind hearted patriot doing what he does for the sake of the republic and goodness of his heart, and the other charade being that he's just a politician and nothing more.

Even if you see past his warm exterior he'd still be acting like any political power would under normal circumstances, using his authority to try and increase his influence and term leading the senate, and commuting dubious activities to sure up his power base. None of that is really "sith" activity per-say, more just the standard backroom dealings and pragmatic ambition that many who serve in the political realm have.

To go from "he's an ambitious politician trying to serve himself" to "he's the embodiment of the darkside trying to destroy the galactic republic" would be a radical notion to convince people of, and not have it sound like ludicrous hyperbole from someone trying to delegitimize a political power. As ludicrous as any of the "My opponent is evil" calls you hear in modern politics today. It's one of the reasons I think palpatines "disguise" as it were is pretty ingenious, as it allows a leeway of ambition and power consolidation with a plausible deniability, at least beyond being called a sith lord.

At least, that's my take on it.

The Jedi specifically said they sensed the dark side of the Force surrounding the Chancellor. Dooku also told them that the Republic was under Darth Sidious' control. The army that Palpatine was in charge of was created by the Sith. Even in the beginning of Episode II, you and see Yoda looking at Palpatine suspiciously. Add to that all of the executive powers that Palpatine was amassing through shady means, and prolonging the war in order to do so, and a pretty clear picture is painted.

At this point, in the real world, it's basically like Clark Kent wearing glasses and no one knowing he's Superman. It is what it is and you just kinda have to go with it.

 

[jpchewy01]

The Jedi specifically said they sensed the dark side of the Force surrounding the Chancellor. Dooku also told them that the Republic was under Darth Sidious' control. The army that Palpatine was in charge of was created by the Sith. Even in the beginning of Episode II, you and see Yoda looking at Palpatine suspiciously. Add to that all of the executive powers that Palpatine was amassing through shady means, and prolonging the war in order to do so, and a pretty clear picture is painted.

At this point, in the real world, it's basically like Clark Kent wearing glasses and no one knowing he's Superman. It is what it is and you just kinda have to go with it.

But the Republic has religious freedom.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

But the Republic has religious freedom.

Well, we can only go with the EU there, but yes. There was a scene in the Episode III novelization (which isn't canon), as you know, where Palpatine says how the Jedi have no real legal basis to try to arrest or kill him. I'm paraphrasing, but the conversation basically went like this:

MACE: You're under arrest, Chancellor.
PALPY: On what charge?
MACE: You're the Sith Lord.
PALPY: And? Even if that were true, last I checked, the Republic still had religious freedom.

And Palpatine showed a recording of that to the galaxy. I don't think it showed the lightsaber duel, but it essentially showed the Jedi trying to assassinate him. Which would've been cool to have actually had in the movies. I really like the idea that the Jedi spend 13 years chasing the Dark Lord of the Sith, only for their efforts to amount to "So what?"

It drives home the futility of the Clone Wars.

 

[Krajin]

If I remember right, Palpatine was able to hide in front of the Jedi Council due to his mastery of a particular force ability, I think it was either Cloak or Concealment.

I also think the Jedi weren't fit for leading the Clones, they weren't trained for that kind of warfare from my understanding. To add to it, the fight between Yoda and Sidious was doomed to fail from the beginning. Yoda didn't have a developed personal style with his forms. Despite being a Master of Ataru he only practiced the standard rotation with all the strike zones being implemented.

 

[TheSilentWind]

If I remember right, Palpatine was able to hide in front of the Jedi Council due to his mastery of a particular force ability, I think it was either Cloak or Concealment.

I also think the Jedi weren't fit for leading the Clones, they weren't trained for that kind of warfare from my understanding. To add to it, the fight between Yoda and Sidious was doomed to fail from the beginning. Yoda didn't have a developed personal style with his forms. Despite being a Master of Ataru he only practiced the standard rotation with all the strike zones being implemented.

Palpatine mastered Force Stealth, as Force Cloak is basically an ability that turns someone invisible. Yoda was/is one of the greatest force users in history, due to the fact that he has lived for many centuries, and therefore has a lot of experience. In addition to this, according to Wookipidea in this article, "He was known for his legendary wisdom, mastery of the Force and skills in lightsaber combat. It also says here that his lightsaber skills only matched Mace Windu, Count Dooku, and Palpatine, all of which have considerable skill in lightsaber combat. It even says that he mastered all the forms. I personally think it is strategic for Yoda to use Ataru, considering the fact that he is pretty small and while I know the old star wars saying "Size matters not." is important, at times it is when you are pretty small.

Anyways, I like the prequels. My favorite lightsaber combat scenes were Mace Windu vs Palpatine, Yoda vs Palpatine, Qui-Gon Jinn/Obi Wan vs Maul, and Obi Wan vs Anakin. I grew up watching the prequels so I guess my opinion is not like most of you but I guess the three original movies were better.

 

[TwoSidedHeart]

I two grew up with the Originals, but loved the Prequels. Clone Wars is amazing though. ^_^

 

[Brandon Rhea]

If I remember right, Palpatine was able to hide in front of the Jedi Council due to his mastery of a particular force ability, I think it was either Cloak or Concealment.

Palpatine mastered Force Stealth, as Force Cloak is basically an ability that turns someone invisible. Yoda was/is one of the greatest force users in history, due to the fact that he has lived for many centuries, and therefore has a lot of experience. In addition to this, according to Wookipidea in this article, "He was known for his legendary wisdom, mastery of the Force and skills in lightsaber combat. It also says here that his lightsaber skills only matched Mace Windu, Count Dooku, and Palpatine, all of which have considerable skill in lightsaber combat. It even says that he mastered all the forms. I personally think it is strategic for Yoda to use Ataru, considering the fact that he is pretty small and while I know the old star wars saying "Size matters not." is important, at times it is when you are pretty small.

That's all EU information, so while it's true in the EU, it's no longer canon. Just wanted to throw that out there.

I also think the Jedi weren't fit for leading the Clones, they weren't trained for that kind of warfare from my understanding.

The key thing about the Jedi isn't about their military capabilities, as the Clone Wars never should have been fought, but the fact that they were meant to be guardians of peace. Duchess Satine rightfully told Obi-Wan that the Jedi could not, without hypocrisy, defend peace by waging war.

I grew up watching the prequels so I guess my opinion is not like most of you but I guess the three original movies were better.

Most of us did too. I was 10 when Episode I came out, and it was the first Star Wars movie I ever saw. I loved the prequels when I first saw them. After I saw Episode III, I thought it was the best Star Wars movie. Now I think it's the worst Star Wars movie. My opinion, and the opinions of many others, changed over time as we started to look at the saga from a more critical standpoint. It's why many of us also judge Return of the Jedi fairly critically, even though we still think it's a good movie in a lot of respects.

But I don't begrudge anyone for liking the prequels. I wish I did. My opinions on the prequel era as a whole have softened as a result of The Clone Wars salvaging that era, but I still don't really care for the three prequel films themselves.

 

[TheSilentWind]

Most of us did too. I was 10 when Episode I came out, and it was the first Star Wars movie I ever saw. I loved the prequels when I first saw them. After I saw Episode III, I thought it was the best Star Wars movie. Now I think it's the worst Star Wars movie. My opinion, and the opinions of many others, changed over time as we started to look at the saga from a more critical standpoint. It's why many of us also judge Return of the Jedi fairly critically, even though we still think it's a good movie in a lot of respects.

But I don't begrudge anyone for liking the prequels. I wish I did. My opinions on the prequel era as a whole have softened as a result of The Clone Wars salvaging that era, but I still don't really care for the three prequel films themselves.

I'm not going to lie. I only started watching Star Wars in 2010 considering that I grew up in Africa. I still like the prequels, even though I few some scenes as completely useless and like you stated, "looking at the saga from a more critical standpoint". I like the Clone Wars. It is definitely one of my favorite animated series, and it was sad that it ended.

 

[Krajin]

He might of mastered the forms but considering Yoda's moves as you saw in the film followed the same Su-Ma Rotations over again with no variation and predictability at least against Palpatine. Had he applied other forms and variations with a personalized form his smaller size could of paid off with the advantage in his incredible years of experience, could of beaten palpatine or at least caused him more harm than a force push and that repulse between him and Palpatine with the Tutaminus and Lightning being applied against one another.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

I don't really take lightsaber forms into account. Those are just justifications for the over-choreographed fighting of the prequel films. By the time of Episode III, it was essentially lightsaber dancing considering the amount of unnatural choreography that went into it. So when I see Yoda doing the same thing over and over, as you described, I don't see adherence to a form, I see bad stunt coordination.

Though I did like the lightsaber fights in The Clone Wars. Some were dumb but a lot were used really effectively.

 

[Krajin]

The Clone Wars with the CGI you could do allot more and better things with that than just choreographed dance moves with a stick. Like Palpatine V Maul and Savage. That was a cool fight.