BoI: Sellout Takeout OOC

[Logan]

Hey guys, just posting this so everyone is aware that as of 7:05pm EST 8-1-2017, @Crim (based upon previous posting order) has timed out and his turn will be skipped as no extension for time was ever requested. @Force_In_Balance has until 8-3-2017 at 7:05pm EST to make his/her post.

@TAC @Crim @Force_In_Balance

@Fyston @christhebarker

 

[TAC]

Ooooo saucy. Didn't realize this was an "OOC" kind of thread oooo.

*their - gender is non-binary

also @Fyston fair warning you timed out but we didn't call you on it because we weren't fighting yet.

So, you know. Don't do it again, you rascal.

 

[Logan]

I mean at this rate we're gonna hit the hard timer for the thread in general and we haven't even fought yet, so I thought it prudent to kind of push things along.

Passive agrressiveness is cool too, tho

 

[TAC]

I mean at this rate we're gonna hit the hard timer for the thread in general and we haven't even fought yet, so I thought it prudent to kind of push things along.

Passive agrressiveness is cool too, tho

Was it passive? I subtweeted you too. :)

"Hey guys, we gotta really push here" would've sufficed if that was really what you're worried about. Especially since the Jedi aren't posting any quicker than us.

But you were just holding us to the rules, it's fine. They're there for a reason. I just like friendly writing and cool story building is all. :(

 

[Force_In_Balance]

Hmmmm, I wonder how Palist would do 3v1?...........

@TAC

Kidding of course my friend, my post is up.

 

[Force_In_Balance]

Hey @Relent i have a question about your last post.

 

[Valen Pelora]

Hey @Relent i have a question about your last post.

It would be appropriate to ask that question here.

 

[Logan]

Hey @Relent i have a question about your last post.

Ask away friend.

 

[Fyston]

So I am going to wait until all questions are answered before posting in the event that edits need to be made. While it probably won't impact my post, I want to ensure everyone's issues are solved.

 

[Force_In_Balance]

Sorry about the delay folks, I had a heck of a day yesterday. Anyways, onto my questions.

The first is about how the actions in our posts line up and about 'responding actions', while the second is about making sure we all have a similar understanding of the layout we have all off-handedly described.

So, my first question is whether or not Sena was approaching Vetas when he was in the HALL you note (I.E. The first paragraph of my post) and just making his approach to the scene of the confrontation OR when he was in the initial room your characters entered from (I.E. The kitchen) as it is the last actually defined room you guys went through before going down a hall to approach @TAC 's character, and was about to throw the grenade? Which your post also implies in that he is holding the grenade when she approaches. Since both the area described and action being performed don't match up I was curious as to what was unclear in my post?

Moving on to 'responding actions' I think we get into a bit of iffy territory here and this really does depend on what the clarifications for the above ARE. While I understand we're all itching to get combat underway in true, earnest fashion depending on what is intended above some things become rather obvious. If, for example. Sena is moving to intercept during the first paragraph of my post (in the Hall) then that makes a bit of an issue where the posting order is concerned and more confusion for me. As I was under the impression that posts done within the same 'round' or go around of the established order (With me being last) all took place at RELATIVELY the same time, with the beginning of our posts being reactionary and the tail-end being more open for us to act with. Thus, if Sena is approaching him within my first paragraph not only is the (admittedly) convenient timing of her similar plan only made more obvious (I don't really mind it, as I agree we need to get earnest combat underway) it does raise the concern that as the last person in the posting order, that is basically 3/4 of my post simply cut off. While I am aware reactions to actions can be made, given the nature of how Sena is approaching Vetas, she's not really reacting to anything and thus my post has made no true impact and would be just as effective as having stated in a simple sentence of "My character shows up".

Now, I'm not using an angry or upset tone here, that is just what stands out to me IF that is the given case, and I don't particularly think that is even the more likely case and is just a bit of confusion as to the lay-out I described. Nonetheless, it's there if indeed it is the case.

What I think is more likely the case intended is that Sena turns around and might run into him in the room described in my post as where Vetas' initial hallway connected to (The Kitchen). Where we come to a couple other things I think warrant pointing out or clarifying.

1) In an attempt to keep in line with what the Jedi characters described of the lay-out, I was under the impression that given they only went through a doorway to engage Palist that the hall they were in was incredibly short, as they engaged him almost instantly upon going through. To be frank, I thought the twenty feet described in my post was generous.

2) In their posts, the room Vetas would be in is described as 'near pitch-black' and no lights are turned on. In addition, it is expressly noted in my post that he moves to an especially dark corner before taking out the grenade, and given his hidden Force signature when the Jedi had to rely on the Force to see earlier and the fact that there is NO lighting... I'm incredibly doubtful Sena would even notice him.

3) At the absolute very least, if we decide to push Sena noticing him for the sole sake of getting to combat sooner, it makes far too much sense for him to throw the grenade at her as she starts to turn around. I had a terrible pun worked out for Relent about playing ball and everything! Dx But no in all seriousness I'd rather avoid getting into a "nuh uhI threw it before you turned" kind of thing with my next post, as that does little to advance things without me then typing out the rest of my post based on that assumption, as it would have to be the first thing noted in it.

4) Not particularly fond of the idea of my next response taking these into account, IF they're agreed upon, and acting upon them with Relent not having the option to consider them in their own post. I'd very much prefer to hear thoughts and opinions on this, even if they're telling me to suck it up and stop typing so much lol, and let them be weighed for Relent as these questions are in response to their post.

Apologies for typing so much all.

 

[Fyston]

FiB, I'm not quite sure but I didn't see anything in your most recent post about Vetas continuing to hide his Force Signature. I'm also going to argue that Force Sight is not seeing the Force but, rather, using the Force to see and augmenting one's abilities that way.

Edit: I stand corrected in that you did state that, "Making sure to keep his weight evenly distributed, his steps silent and Force signature as muted as possible."

Also, unless I am mistaken (possible considering RL happenstance), Relent did not mention focusing solely on TAC's character to the exclusion of all else and it makes sense that, if two out of three move forward, one person will pull rear security to prevent flanking maneuvers or act as a flanking element themselves.

I'm gonna try to put together a fairly coherent discussion but yesterday's shift was interesting at best so if I come off as a jerk, I apologize in advance.

Anyway, your actions can be interrupted by other characters and their actions. If you post this: "John, angry at Joe, pulled his pistol from his holster and fired three times at the man" and I post this: "Joe, seeing John move towards his holster, used the Force to pull John's pants down," I have interrupted (or attempted to interrupt) your actions. However, to the best of my knowledge, you cannot interrupt an interrupt as your actions are, effectively, locked in. So if I go to attack you and you interrupt me, I can't go "nah, I never would have done that." IIRC, and this is how I've seen most do it, you can do a backup action. In my post, for example, I left enough room that if TAC's character would have tried to keep me from entering the hallway, I would not have necessarily been locked in to that action: "In addition, the Knight kept enough space so that, if needed, he could fall back into the previous room"

Relent's post had him attempting to flank and happening upon you and he interrupted your actions. While it sucks, he didn't attack you and left you room to, next round, initiate combat on an even playing field. I've seen it done in the past that people will use the fact that you locked yourself in to give them an (at least momentary) advantage as they initiate combat.

Also, I'm all for creating a diagram of the area together so that it's fair and fits with what everyone is saying. Here is what I imagined when first entering the area :


Top is hallway with TAC's char, not really to scale. OPEN means open space and JEDI means Xene and Fabian. I just did that for reference to where, in my mind's eye, we are now. Dots because my other attempt using spaces did not work.

|..TAC.....|
|..OPEN...|
|...JEDI....|
___________|..............|___________
|.....................................................|
|.....................................................|
|.....................................................|
|.....................................................|
|.....................................................|
|.....................................................|
|.....................................................|
_______________________________
​

Now, as a kitchen/dining room thing (I think even the Jedi's side of the posts might have confused this somewhat), I imagined it would have tiny rooms (a freezer, a pantry, etc) but nothing huge. Obviously, I'm one of six writers who each have their own mental image so I'm not arguing about hallway placement, etc, I just want to get an accurate account so that, moving forward, we know what's around us space-wise.

 

[Logan]

yeah so its real early and yall are posting way more than my dead eyes can read rn so im gonna ask you to kind of.. condense your long post into actual questions you have for me? i tried reading through to find but im just getting confused.

my post would act as an interupt to your actions, so yes. your previous post has been rendered (mostly) moot and that's unfortunate, but that is (generally) what can and will happen when you try to jam many actions into a single post. odds are you're not gonna get to do at least half of 'em.

so your next post would begin as if they met where they are and he never had snuck up behind us and thrown the grenade/done lighting or whatever.

 

[Force_In_Balance]

Alright, to be much more concise. I'm absolutely fine with 'plot coincidence' being used to establish a combat setting, in this case, Sena conveniently moving towards Vetas as he moves to flank them, if he were in the open. However, I am very much against this kind of player-caused 'coincidence' being used to give yourself an advantage as Sena moves towards Vetas in the EXACT moment after he pulls out the grenade, but before he throws it, AND manages to notice him in a pitch black room while his Force signature is cloaked.

 

[Logan]

Alright, to be much more concise. I'm absolutely fine with 'plot coincidence' being used to establish a combat setting, in this case, Sena conveniently moving towards Vetas as he moves to flank them, if he were in the open. However, I am very much against this kind of player-caused 'coincidence' being used to give yourself an advantage as Sena moves towards Vetas in the EXACT moment after he pulls out the grenade, but before he throws it, AND manages to notice him in a pitch black room while his Force signature is cloaked.

It's about as convenient as a particularly placed hallway that's lavishly carpeted just running into a perfect flanking position, so I really don't think you should be bent out of shape about it at all to be perfectly honest.

If it'll appease you I can edit in a way for her to see him.

 

[Fyston]

PvP is all about out-writing your opponent. It is not coincidence, you committed yourself to these actions and that was when Relent chose to interrupt you. He could have gone further and attacked you (and you, having no weapon drawn at the time) would be at a disadvantage. Nobody is forced to allow you to complete everything you attempt when it comes to PvP, otherwise I could launch forty missiles, call in an airstrike, radio for backup, and escape and, because I was unable to be interrupted, I am at least flying happily away. You and Relent are, essentially, going to begin fighting on even ground. Yeah, you have to draw a weapon but he's giving your character the time to do so. Also, it's not like we're interrupting your EMP throw (and what appears to be a lengthy trajectory calculation period beforehand) and your kool-aid flavored Sith lightning to allow us unfettered access to the objective or allow us to, essentially, avoid PvP.

 

[Force_In_Balance]

Haha kool-aid flavored. Good one. xD

But anyways, to answer Relent. The mansion has already been described as lavish and ostentatious. Thus something as simple as carpeting and commonplace in large homes as multiple hallways doesn't exactly require suspending disbelief. It's something that makes sense for the setting.

To answer Fyston, that's also an issue. This is not a strategy game, this is a role-playing site. Everything my character did was within the realm of sense, especially given Trepidus seemingly freezing up (Crim being timed out) so naturally anyone with any tactical sense is going to avoid an outright 2v3 fight.

I don't mean to sound aggressive about this, I'm just saying that the fact that Sena turns around at THAT exact moment is obviously Relent using their knowledge as the writer with access to my post, and not Sena's own about her situation. With the reasoning of her spontaneously getting the idea to flank at the exact same time as my character being rather flimsy. Especially considering that in Relent's own post she is very.... well to paraphrase...no Sith would get in their way... she would be there to support Xen and Fabian.... etc. That doesn't exactly sound like someone who would suddenly get the idea to up and leave to go and try to flank. I realize we're all pulling for our characters here guys but shit at the realistically worst my post would have done is left Sena with a lump on her head and blocking some kool-aid Sith Lightning.

 

[Logan]

It's not outside the realm of reason (in my honest opinion) to see a single foe, having two of your allies posted in front, to not want to charge between them and take point. Noticing a hallway and assuming that it wraps around (like most estates would) is a perfectly normal decision when moving the only other direction (forward) is not smart.

Like I'm sorry but I'm not changing that part. I can edit in something to address the lighting issue, I'm fine with that. But I consider the basic premise of the post sound. If you do not, reporting it is an option.

 

[Fyston]

Due to the fact that this discussion is ongoing and that I work from 0500 tomorrow morning (and thus must be going to bed soon) until at least 0700 Monday, I am requesting an extension until 2359 Monday night EST. @Arclight @Phoenix @GABA-wan Kenobi

I may not need said extension if call volume allows me to post, I just want to cover my bases as I would time out tomorrow at 2230ish

 

[Force_In_Balance]

That seems fine to me Relent. Again, I'm not trying to be aggressive or anything, and I appreciate the consideration.

 

[Arcangel]

Due to the fact that this discussion is ongoing and that I work from 0500 tomorrow morning (and thus must be going to bed soon) until at least 0700 Monday, I am requesting an extension until 2359 Monday night EST. @Arclight @Phoenix @GABA-wan Kenobi

I may not need said extension if call volume allows me to post, I just want to cover my bases as I would time out tomorrow at 2230ish

Best I can give you is 24 hours, so 24 hour extension granted.