The Good, The Bad and The Dirty OOC

[Phoenix]

No, no, no big fight just yet, don't get too excited. Just wondering @Herrith if you'd be willing to repost? It seems you just barely ninja'd me and I think it'd be better to have each side posting in chunks rather than every other person? :D

@Orbit @Nefieslab

 

[Herrith]

Understood.

Sorry, speedposting came.
Real quick, I think I'm in the dark as to why we're getting into trouble.

FTG got attacked by Sith?

Edit: Deed is done.

 

[Phoenix]

Understood.

Sorry, speedposting came.
Real quick, I think I'm in the dark as to why we're getting into trouble.

FTG got attacked by Sith?

Thanks! And yeah, the Sith attacked and took over the FTG shipyards, so BH are doing some preventive assassination because.... well, that's kinda what they do :|

 

[Herrith]

Thanks! And yeah, the Sith attacked and took over the FTG shipyards, so BH are doing some preventive assassination because.... well, that's kinda what they do :|

I see.

Guess this is unfortunate.
*speed dials Sith friends to help defuse this*
"Uh, yeah, your guys are trying to stab me and stuff, and I'd rather not have to get stabbed and do stabbing."

Well, we'll see how hard I faceplant here now.

 

[Nefieslab]

So should we change this thread to Ask now? Don't want it to get too crowded ;)

 

[Phoenix]

So should we change this thread to Ask now? Don't want it to get too crowded ;)

I dun care

 

[Nefieslab]

Changed the thread to Ask so it stays clean and tidy!
If you got issues with it - say so now or forever hold your peace etc etc

@Orbit @Herrith

 

[Orbit]

I request a 24 hour extension.

@Clayton

 

[Nefieslab]

Just to clarify @Orbit & @Phoenix but the wording of the post about the Force pull has it "wrapping around Allard before strongly and roughly pulling him forward away from the ship" - doesn't that mean that it's affecting his body directly and is then uncounterable?

This is my first non-FS character in a PVP but I was under the impression that the Force couldn't be used directly on the bodies of non-FS characters in PVP as it's then not counterable and is against the rules?

Just asking for clarification at this stage since I'm a noob when it comes to non-FS vs FS :D

 

[Phoenix]

Just to clarify @Orbit & @Phoenix but the wording of the post about the Force pull has it "wrapping around Allard before strongly and roughly pulling him forward away from the ship" - doesn't that mean that it's affecting his body directly and is then uncounterable?

This is my first non-FS character in a PVP but I was under the impression that the Force couldn't be used directly on the bodies of non-FS characters in PVP as it's then not counterable and is against the rules?

Just asking for clarification at this stage since I'm a noob when it comes to non-FS vs FS :D

No, it is still allowed. You can try to break the concentration of the person doing the grabbing, and I imagine that a level 4 non-FS would have greater physical strength to resist. You couldn't negate it entirely, but even a FS would have trouble doing that.

Edit: In other words, it just requires a different type of defense than a FS would

 

[Nefieslab]

No, it is still allowed. You can try to break the concentration of the person doing the grabbing, and I imagine that a level 4 non-FS would have greater physical strength to resist. You couldn't negate it entirely, but even a FS would have trouble doing that.

Edit: In other words, it just requires a different type of defense than a FS would

Sweet - just wanted to double check :D

 

[Orbit]

@Nefieslab Hey, I would recommend taking the torpedo out of this fight. It isn't pinpoint accurate, where you know the splash damage is going to stop before it hits your character. I think the torpedo would actually kill all of us.

 

[Nefieslab]

@Orbit

Gonna have to disagree there man. Sure, it's not pinpoint accurate but that's why it's being aimed behind you and not at your feet for example.

The splash damage might not exactly be known to you or I - but the shot is fired by a character who fires it for a living so I would say he would have a much better grasp of how large a proton torpedo explosion is.

Added to that, we have no concrete measurements for our fight unless I add them to our fight right now. You opened with "a respectable distance away from the two". So I'm going to go ahead and argue that a respectable distance away is 30 meters - just slightly larger than a basket ball court, on the edge of Herrith's blaster pistol range and reasonable distance for you to appear from considering both Allard and Herrith were on watch for slaver reinforcements and, you know, The Eternal feels like icy death - and that Allard's combat roll brings him a meter and a bit closer to The Eternal (who hasn't moved forwards at all, just to the right iirc) so probably putting us at 28 meters away from each other (the actual length of a basket ball court).

If the torpedo explodes ten meters behind you, that means it would need to have an effective blast radius of 38 meters to include Allard as well. If it has a blast radius of, say, 20 meters (4 times the radius of a grenade) and it hits 10 meters behind you, the blast radius would stop 18 meters away from Allard and he would only need to worry about debris and other dangers - which I'm happy to do. If it has a blast radius of 30 meters then it can be fired further back as the gunner would know this.

So I'm still happy to keep it in there unless a single proton torpedo is said to have a ridiculous yield that means it's radius is like 50 to 100 meters (that'd mean that almost any ship hit by one would be engulfed in the explosion entirely)

 

[Nefieslab]

After having discussed with the tech team, it has been confirmed that using a photon torpedo would be ruled to have killed everyone involved. And as tempting as that idea sounded for a moment... (:P) I agree it's probably not a good move.

With that in mind, I'm going to edit my post to remove the torpedo attack.

To confirm, is everyone still okay with the distance between the two groups starting at 30 meters? Just so we know what we're dealing with going forwards, you know?

@Orbit @Herrith @Phoenix

 

[Phoenix]

After having discussed with the tech team, it has been confirmed that using a photon torpedo would be ruled to have killed everyone involved. And as tempting as that idea sounded for a moment... (:P) I agree it's probably not a good move.

With that in mind, I'm going to edit my post to remove the torpedo attack.

To confirm, is everyone still okay with the distance between the two groups starting at 30 meters? Just so we know what we're dealing with going forwards, you know?

@Orbit @Herrith @Phoenix

I confess I did envisions being closer (15-20), but if we are insistently on 30 I can live with that too

 

[Nefieslab]

Yo @Orbit - timing is off there man

You've got it like this,

- Herrith uses the Force
- You counter
- Allard fires
- You block two shots
- Cannon fires once
- You block
- Cannon fires again
- You block

That's completely ignoring what I've said in my post- Allard and the Ship fire at the same time and Herrith attacks the neck when Allard fires. They're not happening one at a time - even if we split up the duo of blaster shots (which I see you did for the cannon but not the Allards shots for some reason) it should go like this;

- Allard fires first shot, cannon fires first shot, Herrith uses the Force
- Allard fires second shot, cannon fires second shot

Cus right now the way it's written has you ignoring when things were actually stated to happen to make them all come at The Eternal in nice, sequential, fashion as if lining up perfectly for blocking- which goes against what was said in post

Also, I know lightsabers can deflect blasters from ships but examples in canon involve two handed deflection iirc so I'm not sure about The Eternal being able to deflect two such blasts perfectly with one hand, while he should also be dealing with a rifle blaster bolt and a Force attack at the same time

Even if you did, the ships shields have no reason to be down so I don't believe you've destroyed anything on the ship - especially seeing as even if you do deflect it perfectly and the shield is off for some reason, the ship has armour plating

So there's my two cents as it were xD

 

[Herrith]

Okay, I'll hop in from the peanut gallery, too.

I also agree with the timing--if stuff like that is ever confusing, just ask, cause I fail at writing sometimes.

I also disagree with deflecting a starship cannon, specifically without bracing to deflect a huge amount of energy and moreover with just a single hand.

As for Herrith's attempt at that neck snap, I'm not sure if instinctive Force powers are necessarily weaker or the sameas normal, though just dismissing it without much thought makes it look like they are. I know my character is a lower level, and I'm not overly experienced in Force-related RPing and the like, so I just want some clarification.

(@Orbit )

 

[Phoenix]

So I know Orbit isn't on right now, but I wanted to drop some thoughts in here before I head to work and will probably be unable to make a long post until this evening.

Yo @Orbit - timing is off there man

You've got it like this,

- Herrith uses the Force
- You counter
- Allard fires
- You block two shots
- Cannon fires once
- You block
- Cannon fires again
- You block

That's completely ignoring what I've said in my post- Allard and the Ship fire at the same time and Herrith attacks the neck when Allard fires. They're not happening one at a time - even if we split up the duo of blaster shots (which I see you did for the cannon but not the Allards shots for some reason) it should go like this;

- Allard fires first shot, cannon fires first shot, Herrith uses the Force
- Allard fires second shot, cannon fires second shot

Cus right now the way it's written has you ignoring when things were actually stated to happen to make them all come at The Eternal in nice, sequential, fashion as if lining up perfectly for blocking- which goes against what was said in post

I think the assumption he's making is that the NPC pilots are not psychic. They would need some sort of indication (i.e. seeing a blaster firing at the Eternal) to know to begin firing or else why would they fire within nanoseconds of Allard firing? There would be some sort of momentary gap between them being able to see that and firing, I believe or else it really comes off as metagaming.

It's honestly somewhat of a moot point and nitpicky anyway, though, because he could just use his other saber to do the exact same thing without much of an issue since it's literally not doing anything until the second canon shot, but I'm guessing he'd be happy to change that if there was something he did to mess up the timing and the NPCs are actually psychic.

Also, I know lightsabers can deflect blasters from ships but examples in canon involve two handed deflection iirc so I'm not sure about The Eternal being able to deflect two such blasts perfectly with one hand, while he should also be dealing with a rifle blaster bolt and a Force attack at the same time

Honestly, I can't imagine a level 4 FS would have that much trouble doing this

Even if you did, the ships shields have no reason to be down so I don't believe you've destroyed anything on the ship - especially seeing as even if you do deflect it perfectly and the shield is off for some reason, the ship has armour plating

So there's my two cents as it were xD

The ship was totally idle at the start of the thread and you never mentioned raising the shields that I saw, so the shields aren't up. Especially considering we're already letting you use NPCs, I'm not going to go for them doing a lot of "off screen" stuff that hasn't been stated.

As for the armor plating, I've already asked and one shot from a blaster canon is enough to disable the turret

Okay, I'll hop in from the peanut gallery, too.

I also agree with the timing--if stuff like that is ever confusing, just ask, cause I fail at writing sometimes.

I also disagree with deflecting a starship cannon, specifically without bracing to deflect a huge amount of energy and moreover with just a single hand.

As for Herrith's attempt at that neck snap, I'm not sure if instinctive Force powers are necessarily weaker or the sameas normal, though just dismissing it without much thought makes it look like they are. I know my character is a lower level, and I'm not overly experienced in Force-related RPing and the like, so I just want some clarification.

(@Orbit )

From the PvP guide:
"Is this an instinctual attack that is being put together in a fraction of a second to save your skin or a well-prepared attack that your character has been planning to execute? Increased time to prepare and shape the Force is going to mean that a manifestation is both less likely to fail, more powerful, and less tiring."

Instinctual attacks are absolutely less powerful

Edit: As an aside, has Herrith ever actually had official training in the Force? Because if not, your character would be having a much more difficult time with all this and quite drained. The FS rules regarding level are assuming a life time of training and instruction. Someone with no training would be nowhere near as powerful as someone who has trained their whole life and would be at least 1-2 levels below someone who focuses on that. If she's had training, that might change things some, but not sure, which is why I'm asking.

 

[Orbit]

I've edited my post for the Eternal's right saber to block both cannon shots at him and make it more transparent on how it happened. As for the other reasons the post was brought up in this OOC, I believe @Phoenix did an excellent job explaining how for the rest of it.

 

[Nefieslab]

I think the assumption he's making is that the NPC pilots are not psychic. They would need some sort of indication (i.e. seeing a blaster firing at the Eternal) to know to begin firing or else why would they fire within nanoseconds of Allard firing? There would be some sort of momentary gap between them being able to see that and firing, I believe or else it really comes off as metagaming.

It's honestly somewhat of a moot point and nitpicky anyway, though, because he could just use his other saber to do the exact same thing without much of an issue since it's literally not doing anything until the second canon shot, but I'm guessing he'd be happy to change that if there was something he did to mess up the timing and the NPCs are actually psychic.

Lol - they are twins, does that count as psychic? ;)

Seriously though, Allard gave them the order to be ready at their stations ("Keep the lights on") to fire before anyone engaged in combat and gave the target ("Masked karker!") before he was pulled. So they'd be ready and have the target by the time Allard was coming out of his roll forward to fire.

The second cannon shot I could see being no issue as it would come after the rest of the attacks.

The ship was totally idle at the start of the thread and you never mentioned raising the shields that I saw, so the shields aren't up. Especially considering we're already letting you use NPCs, I'm not going to go for them doing a lot of "off screen" stuff that hasn't been stated.

As for the armor plating, I've already asked and one shot from a blaster canon is enough to disable the turret

I mean, the ship only recently landed into what it knew to be hostile territory as it was a slaver camp they just attacked. But alright, I'll concede the point on that