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[Suggestion] Living Economy
- Thread starter Dunbar Snackbar
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That was damned impressive man! At first (I'll be honest), I was thinking "aw crap, it's gonna be one of those long complicated bla-bla-bla", but this made a lot of sense. I really like this idea! Not sure if the admins will back it, but at least on the unofficial front, I'm totally behind this. I'd even like to help out with it, if need be.
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Well I watched your video man and I got to say absolutely a great idea. Honestly I think it's creative and would help solve some problems and make the next timeline seem more realistic.
That being said it would be one massive chore. It would be tough, I don't know how many members there are on this site, or how many members there will be. But there will be many, and I don't think that sytem can hold up.
Like I said a fabulous idea, but an unrealistic one.
That being said it would be one massive chore. It would be tough, I don't know how many members there are on this site, or how many members there will be. But there will be many, and I don't think that sytem can hold up.
Like I said a fabulous idea, but an unrealistic one.
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Unless I misunderstood something, the only real chore of it, aside from deciding on prices (simple enough) is the "maintenance". Just gotta keep it updated, and the rest more or less takes care of itself.
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I usually tend to stay on the side of less mechanics is better, but I really like the work you put into this. In the end, I think this would be best if it was an optional way to play than a rule. It would be impossible to police thoroughly, but with that being said, it could be a lot of fun for those that are interested I'm being thorough with their credits and assets. Really awesome video! Keep up the good work.
Beta12
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I think that this idea holds a lot of merit, and I congratulate you for coming up with it!
This could solve a lot of issues we have with factions, and even with characters later down the line.
With factions, especially minor ones, coming up with funds and fleets have always been an issue of contention and debate. There really isn't a way to realistically go about collecting funds and ships without leaps of logic and other sketchy routes. For example, I have seen plenty of factions be asked to tone down the amount of ships and credits they start out with to keep them from being too powerful, but the way they grow after that is generally confusing and not really discussed.
Sure, they can take a world, but there really isn't any value or benefit too it unless the FL decides that there is and then poof, more magic income and ships leak their way into the FL's factions.
A living economy polices factions and makes sure they they grow and ebb realistically. With a living economy, factions will have to try and gain worlds and ships through reasonable means. There will be risk and reward to rp's in this sense, as a major conquest could result in the destruction of your hard earned fleet. The lost world could result in a decline in income and it can even take longer for your power to grow back again.
In writing, we saw something like it before the timeskip with the Chiss faction. To explain there going away in the timeline, they were described to have defaulted on their loans, and had their fleets repossessed by the Hutt cartel, basically crippling their faction. Wouldn't it be cool if something like that happened in the new timeline based on this new mechanic? It would force FL's to be more involved in how their faction actually grows and expands, and it would make war a lot more realistic as there would be way more at stake than territory, loosing a world could severely effect a factions income.
This would make it so factions in the new timeline start on an even footing, and are forced to claw their way up through a real system of economics rather than wishy washy freeform writing that ensures everyone remains succesful. This living economy could be in the main factor of what it means to be a main faction. It would also help regulate the new factions that pop up.
Of course at some point there will be factions that become economic juggernauts, which might sound like a bad idea at first, but it would encourage the forging of alliances between major factions and smaller factions. This could benefit both factions income and give smaller factions a chance to grow. It could also result in neat little proxy wars where main factions don't necessarily fight each other, but get their smaller allied factions to fight each other over smaller systems. That way, all factions play an important role in the arc of the timeline, and can be made or broken by how their members affect its success.
The most important thing:
It could also open new and interesting roles for factions. A person could realistically make a yacht company in which wealthy individuals might use to travel about or host social rp's. It would actually cost money, which is a risk, but might get people interested in joining the faction that payed for the event, a reward.
At the same time, factions would have to be concerned about budgeting in a realistic way. If you want to put a bounty on someone, the reward will come out of your faction coffers so now you have to consider how much you actually want them dead.
Factions based around writing elements such as slavery now have a realistic reason to go into such endeavors, because other characters might pay for servants, ect.
At the same time it could make interesting roles for people outside of the faction. For example characters can actually have jobs and be employed. A faction could have a pay scale in which small portions of their income are doled out to specific members, so people realistically gain money for the work that they do. It would also open up major roles for indie characters such as smugglers and entertainers. Factions might pay for an entertainer character to perform at a social event, and a cartel might higher smugglers to run supplies for them to other factions.
On top of all of that, it would actually make factions that sell tech something more than a writing device, it would make them actual markets. It would also encourage people to be inventive with the things that they attempt to sell and create.
EDIT:
A way to make this work, or to try it out at first, would just to have the living economy apply to factions, and let it eventually trickle down to members that might want to keep control of their personal assets.
Also, there could be a dedicated staff member position made to regulate this system if anyone is up to that idea, sort of like how the tech admin polices and approves tech, the economy admin could police and approve income amounts coming from planets and other resources, as well as selling prices attached to tech.
For example, if people want to make income off of something, they describe what it is (a planet, mining facility, trading company), explain how it makes them income, and how much income they think it should give them. Which can then be decided upon and implemented into the spread sheet.
This could solve a lot of issues we have with factions, and even with characters later down the line.
With factions, especially minor ones, coming up with funds and fleets have always been an issue of contention and debate. There really isn't a way to realistically go about collecting funds and ships without leaps of logic and other sketchy routes. For example, I have seen plenty of factions be asked to tone down the amount of ships and credits they start out with to keep them from being too powerful, but the way they grow after that is generally confusing and not really discussed.
Sure, they can take a world, but there really isn't any value or benefit too it unless the FL decides that there is and then poof, more magic income and ships leak their way into the FL's factions.
A living economy polices factions and makes sure they they grow and ebb realistically. With a living economy, factions will have to try and gain worlds and ships through reasonable means. There will be risk and reward to rp's in this sense, as a major conquest could result in the destruction of your hard earned fleet. The lost world could result in a decline in income and it can even take longer for your power to grow back again.
In writing, we saw something like it before the timeskip with the Chiss faction. To explain there going away in the timeline, they were described to have defaulted on their loans, and had their fleets repossessed by the Hutt cartel, basically crippling their faction. Wouldn't it be cool if something like that happened in the new timeline based on this new mechanic? It would force FL's to be more involved in how their faction actually grows and expands, and it would make war a lot more realistic as there would be way more at stake than territory, loosing a world could severely effect a factions income.
This would make it so factions in the new timeline start on an even footing, and are forced to claw their way up through a real system of economics rather than wishy washy freeform writing that ensures everyone remains succesful. This living economy could be in the main factor of what it means to be a main faction. It would also help regulate the new factions that pop up.
Of course at some point there will be factions that become economic juggernauts, which might sound like a bad idea at first, but it would encourage the forging of alliances between major factions and smaller factions. This could benefit both factions income and give smaller factions a chance to grow. It could also result in neat little proxy wars where main factions don't necessarily fight each other, but get their smaller allied factions to fight each other over smaller systems. That way, all factions play an important role in the arc of the timeline, and can be made or broken by how their members affect its success.
The most important thing:
It could also open new and interesting roles for factions. A person could realistically make a yacht company in which wealthy individuals might use to travel about or host social rp's. It would actually cost money, which is a risk, but might get people interested in joining the faction that payed for the event, a reward.
At the same time, factions would have to be concerned about budgeting in a realistic way. If you want to put a bounty on someone, the reward will come out of your faction coffers so now you have to consider how much you actually want them dead.
Factions based around writing elements such as slavery now have a realistic reason to go into such endeavors, because other characters might pay for servants, ect.
At the same time it could make interesting roles for people outside of the faction. For example characters can actually have jobs and be employed. A faction could have a pay scale in which small portions of their income are doled out to specific members, so people realistically gain money for the work that they do. It would also open up major roles for indie characters such as smugglers and entertainers. Factions might pay for an entertainer character to perform at a social event, and a cartel might higher smugglers to run supplies for them to other factions.
On top of all of that, it would actually make factions that sell tech something more than a writing device, it would make them actual markets. It would also encourage people to be inventive with the things that they attempt to sell and create.
EDIT:
A way to make this work, or to try it out at first, would just to have the living economy apply to factions, and let it eventually trickle down to members that might want to keep control of their personal assets.
Also, there could be a dedicated staff member position made to regulate this system if anyone is up to that idea, sort of like how the tech admin polices and approves tech, the economy admin could police and approve income amounts coming from planets and other resources, as well as selling prices attached to tech.
For example, if people want to make income off of something, they describe what it is (a planet, mining facility, trading company), explain how it makes them income, and how much income they think it should give them. Which can then be decided upon and implemented into the spread sheet.
Last edited:
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Good work here. Well thought out. However, I feel that a living economy may had a too complicated layer to SWRP than is necessary, both on the member-level and the management-level. Most members come here to relax and enjoy themselves, to write innovative stories. Being boggled down and restricted on their ingenuity by an enforced economy would be a con, and could dissuade many members from participation. Not to mention the time it would take away from members and management from doing things more enjoyable or more important. Speaking from someone who had an economy-based setting in a previous site I was in (granted it wasn't SWRP or as better thought out as yours), it does not do well for the site. Some members jump onto the economy train and ride it into grinding financial empires and crush the little guys who don't care about the economy and just want to have fun. As such, I'm not sure if your living economy proposal will have a place in the next timeline. That's not to say you and others cannot use it at your own prerogative or on a personal level, but it is unlikely it will end up site-wide.
Beta12
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That is a fair point, it probably would divert people from wanting to make factions based on the fact that a hobby would become a mini-job to make sure you faction survives and excels.
It would be interesting to see it ran in a more passive manner, though, and perhaps intertwined with the way factions declare war. It would be nice to see factions reliant on actually having to buy ships and forces rather than write them up and send them out. Of course, not all factions would have to focus around it or partake in it, but it would be interesting to see how main factions such as a galactic alliance or sith imperium fare in a major war if their worlds and territories and ships actually mean something.
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The disagreement I've always had with factions being required to pay for their ships is that it's inherently limiting. It is a bit of a free for all when factions can just send out ships where they want, granted, but it also allows for more opportunities for battle. And ultimately our timelines thrive on battles, so it could easily become a one-sided conflict or even have a conflict grind to a halt if factions are required to deal with a financial system.
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All great points of discussion! I appreciate the feedback. :)
I knew all of you would know if this would be helpful or not far better than I coudl. I understand that with me being as new as I am, I don't have a full understanding of the flow, mechanics and culture of the site and its writers. I was part of a forum based SW BatteSim sometime ago where something like this was used to great effect. This site could be a different story. Therefore, I am happy to defer to your good judgement regarding an economy being a good idea or not. If you all feel in the future that a stock market or an economy system like this would be beneficial, I would be happy to recreate the things shown in the video upon your request.
Thanks everyone!
I knew all of you would know if this would be helpful or not far better than I coudl. I understand that with me being as new as I am, I don't have a full understanding of the flow, mechanics and culture of the site and its writers. I was part of a forum based SW BatteSim sometime ago where something like this was used to great effect. This site could be a different story. Therefore, I am happy to defer to your good judgement regarding an economy being a good idea or not. If you all feel in the future that a stock market or an economy system like this would be beneficial, I would be happy to recreate the things shown in the video upon your request.
Thanks everyone!
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The various economies in Star Wars have always been somewhat ambiguous, anyways. Usually, it wasn't even much of a point of consideration until TCW came around, and even then it was a call to action to get characters to a pretty MacQuarrie inspired locale in order for them to get caught up in a fight for their lives. Now, I could see the need for various resources in the next Timeline be cause for conflict in particular sectors, but even then that would be more flavor and objective.
For example, Republic and Imperial forces are clashing in the XYZ Sector for its rich whatsium mines, a compound critical for the manufacture of plot armor. Rather than fighting a standard pitched battle, you have blockades combat and missions that revolve more around controlling strategic points of resource production rather than your usual urban/forest combat as seen in SW. Whichever side emerges victorious, perhaps the ships produced after that incident have additional armor. This would give smuggler and pirate characters opportunities to lift said faction-controlled resources and sell them on the black market.
Since galactic credits never really had a concrete value in the New Canon, it'd be easier to manage as natural resources than cash-money.
For example, Republic and Imperial forces are clashing in the XYZ Sector for its rich whatsium mines, a compound critical for the manufacture of plot armor. Rather than fighting a standard pitched battle, you have blockades combat and missions that revolve more around controlling strategic points of resource production rather than your usual urban/forest combat as seen in SW. Whichever side emerges victorious, perhaps the ships produced after that incident have additional armor. This would give smuggler and pirate characters opportunities to lift said faction-controlled resources and sell them on the black market.
Since galactic credits never really had a concrete value in the New Canon, it'd be easier to manage as natural resources than cash-money.
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I like the idea - but it is somewhat unwieldy.
However, that being said, as an indie faction the ICBC could work, with admin approval - as a stock market trader. I see nothing wrong with an admin supervised stock market, but the planet value stage of the plan is something I cannot see working.
In brief: Stock Market with admin approval - good.
Planet Value - complexed, well thought out, but to much logistically for the majority of members.
However, that being said, as an indie faction the ICBC could work, with admin approval - as a stock market trader. I see nothing wrong with an admin supervised stock market, but the planet value stage of the plan is something I cannot see working.
In brief: Stock Market with admin approval - good.
Planet Value - complexed, well thought out, but to much logistically for the majority of members.
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I don't see why you couldn't simply leave such logistics to a few volunteer members, with any one else wanting to get in on it only if they desire to. After all, there are multiple functions on the site that go on behind the scenes that the common members aren't privy to. I don't think it'd be a concept that can't work, or that it's especially complicated. At least imo, seems that you'd just set a value on something, then it pretty much takes care of itself. Now figuring out the value itself - I'll give you that. That'd need to be carefully decided. But once decided, it's self sufficient.