Rule Changes: Main Factions

[Cainhurst Crow]

Competition in it and of itself is not about being a dick. Competition, combined with a binary division of users(faction restrictions), complete with their own isolated channels of communication (the faction chats), an encouragement to go against one another for limited resources (squares), direct violent confrontation being the norm of resolving disputes (PvP), and the existence of people who can make definitive rulings for and against one another in any scenario (ooc rulings) make for a hostility breeding machine by nature.

I mean, lets break this down here to its simpilest form. You took people, split them into two groups of their choosing, encouraged them to fight one another in an observable goal, made it so that they don't need to work together in any capacity, and actually discouraged such behavior via penalties such as a deducted point system for such threads, and an entire system for stabbing others in the back via espionage, and then made them form cliques and to only stay among their own kind to succeed in the rp. And if anyone had difficulty in this system, the answer to them was to suck it up and get good, or to leave the site/faction they were struggling in.

You kinda made this a sith style player breeder. By playing on the barest of human instict and the natural drive that emerges in a non-serious environment such as a hobby, it invites hostility to fester in mass. If this wasn't a hobby, then people would not be so willing to play into such negative behavior. They'd be forced to get along due to having an obligation to be here. But they don't, so there is actually 0 reason outside of the threat of banning that discourages people from being hostile, negative, and doing whatever it takes to win.

Being surprised when it happens, just seems unprepared for the realities of human nature.

 

[GABA]

How does this prevent people from being hostile to one another?

As I said in my last post, thinking negatively creates negativity, thinking positively creates positive thinking.

Its all how your perceive it and if you continue to perceive it as something negative, then members are going to be hostile to one another. And being hostile to each other over a game is really not necessary. You can have competition without wanting to rip out each others throats.

 

[Elijah Brockway]

As I said in my last post, thinking negatively creates negativity, thinking positively creates positive thinking.

Its all how your perceive it and if you continue to perceive it as something negative, then members are going to be hostile to one another. And being hostile to each other over a game is really not necessary. You can have competition without wanting to rip out each others throats.

 

[Gaiaverse]

As I said in my last post, thinking negatively creates negativity, thinking positively creates positive thinking.

Its all how your perceive it and if you continue to perceive it as something negative, then members are going to be hostile to one another. And being hostile to each other over a game is really not necessary. You can have competition without wanting to rip out each others throats.

Please answer the question. I asked for how to will this rule will prevent hostility, not on competintion or positive vs negative thinking.

 

[Dmitri]

Competition in it and of itself is not about being a dick. Competition, combined with a binary division of users(faction restrictions), complete with their own isolated channels of communication (the faction chats), an encouragement to go against one another for limited resources (squares), direct violent confrontation being the norm of resolving disputes (PvP), and the existence of people who can make definitive rulings for and against one another in any scenario (ooc rulings) make for a hostility breeding machine by nature.

I mean, lets break this down here to its simpilest form. You took people, split them into two groups of their choosing, encouraged them to fight one another in an observable goal, made it so that they don't need to work together in any capacity, and actually discouraged such behavior via penalties such as a deducted point system for such threads, and an entire system for stabbing others in the back via espionage, and then made them form cliques and to only stay among their own kind to succeed in the rp. And if anyone had difficulty in this system, the answer to them was to suck it up and get good, or to leave the site/faction they were struggling in.

You kinda made this a sith style player breeder. By playing on the barest of human instict and the natural drive that emerges in a non-serious environment such as a hobby, it invites hostility to fester in mass. If this wasn't a hobby, then people would not be so willing to play into such negative behavior. They'd be forced to get along due to having an obligation to be here. But they don't, so there is actually 0 reason outside of the threat of banning that discourages people from being hostile, negative, and doing whatever it takes to win.

Being surprised when it happens, just seems unprepared for the realities of human nature.

No system is perfect and the changes for this timeline was an attempt at improvement. Some things were standardized, such as conquest and espionage, because they were a mess. I won't claim whether changes worked, but how they once were wasn't perfect either.

And people can be competitive without being dicks. It's called good sportsmanship. And I'll be frank. We could make all the changes people have made and it won't solve everything . Why? Because until people begin to see themselves responsible for their behavior, bad behavior will continue, passing responsibility to everything under the sun

 

[GABA]

Please stop with the pictures and memes, if you wish to contribute, then please post something productive.

@Gaiaverse

I did answer the question, and it is all about how players what to think. No one is forcing you to think its negative and hostility provoking, that's all on you to believe it is.

 

[Gaiaverse]

Please stop with the pictures and memes, if you wish to contribute, then please post something productive.

@Gaiaverse

I did answer the question, and it is all about how players what to think. No one is forcing you to think its negative and hostility provoking, that's all on you to believe it is.

My question was "How does this prevent people from being hostile to one another?". About the rule, not about people's thinking. As again, this only really helping the Jedi and Republic, while leaving Sith players with their thumbs out, awaiting a taxi that will never come.

 

[Cainhurst Crow]

Nobodies responding to each others posts, nor acknowleding each others points.

So I bid this adieu. Hopefully this rule helps to benefit the republic and jedi more. It'd be a shame if such a rule had no impact or even a negative impact on the site.

 

[GABA]

My question was "How does this prevent people from being hostile to one another?". About the rule, not about people's thinking. As again, this only really helping the Jedi and Republic, while leaving Sith players with their thumbs out, awaiting a taxi that will never come.

Again player behavior is not based on rules. Rules are, no matter where in life, are independent to behavior. It is your choice on how you want to respond to those rules.

 

[Dmitri]

My question was "How does this prevent people from being hostile to one another?". About the rule, not about people's thinking. As again, this only really helping the Jedi and Republic, while leaving Sith players with their thumbs out, awaiting a taxi that will never come.

If we look at Jedi as Force element and Tepublic as the military/political superpower, the Brotherhood has all that wrapped in one the only difference is that Force element Sith and military/political superpower SBZ/Moffs have the same leader and already were allowed dual membership. Looking at it this way we didn't give Jedi and Republic an unfair advantage, we evened the field.

 

[Proleptic]

I am not saying that we aren't already doing this, but let's simply start by being happy with this step. We can worry about the rest in time to come. I appreciate the admins for making this decision :)

 

[Elijah Brockway]

My question was "How does this prevent people from being hostile to one another?". About the rule, not about people's thinking. As again, this only really helping the Jedi and Republic, while leaving Sith players with their thumbs out, awaiting a taxi that will never come.

considering the fact that it was never once said that this addendum to the rules would help mend the hostility issue I'd say there's no way for that question to be answered

because the connection between this rule and limiting hostility was never made

brandon and I both just said people need to stop being so hostile to each other

 

[Gaiaverse]

Again player behavior is not based on rules. Rules are, no matter where in life, are independent to behavior. It is your choice on how you want to respond to those rules.

And bad rules don't help the behavior? They don't breed a sense of gratification, that their animosity are supported by the site rules? Which leads back to my question-How does this fix the issues the site is having?

 

[Elijah Brockway]

not that I like this rule or the small change or anything

but maybe people could behave with a sense of sportsmanship rather than jumping at each other's throats

there is no way at all that all that hostility can be pinned on the rule alone, regardless of how little or how much the rule may contribute to it

the hostility goes beyond any healthy competitiveness here and it's really bothersome to see all the time

 

[Gaiaverse]

If we look at Jedi as Force element and Tepublic as the military/political superpower, the Brotherhood has all that wrapped in one the only difference is that Force element Sith and military/political superpower SBZ/Moffs have the same leader and already were allowed dual membership. Looking at it this way we didn't give Jedi and Republic an unfair advantage, we evened the field.

The Jedi and Republic are two factions, with two different FLs and AFL teams along with player bases. The Sith and SBZ are one faction with one FL and AFL team and player base.

And what happens when the Republic of Jedi have a surge of activity and apps. Or God forbid, the Sith become inactive. What happens? They now have to deal with two very active factions.

 

[GABA]

And bad rules don't help the behavior? They don't breed a sense of gratification, that their animosity are supported by the site rules? Which leads back to my question-How does this fix the issues the site is having?

It won't, that's entirely up to the member base, as I said numerous times before and even when it was proposed (see below) I've stated it there too. Member attitudes are not dependent on the rules. Its up to you to accept them or don't.

Here is my stance:

I think the main faction rule was a good idea in theory, but as we have seen in the last few months, it really didn't make a difference on the site. I was still observing (even myself) how it easy it was to jump from one faction to another. So in practice, its a little shaky.

HOWEVER, I do not believe this contributes to the disgusting attitudes on this site. This is an entirely different topic that has no correlation with the one faction rule. The rules are the rules, completely independent on how you, as members want to react to them. You're more than welcome to hate them, love them, argue them, follow them, but that is on you, you're in charge of your own behavior; and everyone here is old enough to understand that there is a consequence that follows to every action.

So, as for the one MF rule, this is something I guarantee the staff will be discussing because I believe there are some good points made about it in addition to what has been observed on our part.

Thanks!

So I guess, I don't know what else to tell you other than what I have said like three or four times now.

 

[Green Ranger]

I am not saying that we aren't already doing this, but let's simply start by being happy with this step. We can worry about the rest in time to come. I appreciate the admins for making this decision :)

not that I like this rule or the small change or anything

but maybe people could behave with a sense of sportsmanship rather than jumping at each other's throats

there is no way at all that all that hostility can be pinned on the rule alone, regardless of how little or how much the rule may contribute to it

the hostility goes beyond any healthy competitiveness here and it's really bothersome to see all the time

Just gonna quote these for emphasis.

 

[Jabonicus]

Personally, I don't see this rule improving anything. Telling people 'think positive' or 'be more sportsmanlike' isn't going to fix jack shit. If it was, we wouldn't be having the problems of toxicity on the site.

The Site, as a whole, in my opinion, however little readers may think of it, is no longer about telling a story. It's turned to focus about a game of gridsquares, a game of risk. It's no longer about telling a story for a character, now it's "I'm going to do these three requirements so I can do X." Or something equally based off of rules like this is some game to be won.

I came here to tell a story, and I believe current rules prevent that. I owe no loyalty to any faction, instead I owe loyalty to the stories I am trying to create.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

And as GABA said, those rules will continue to be evaluated. If there needs to be more change to this rule and other rules, then how the changes unfold will show the staff that. This is a very reasonable way to go about change.

I think everyone's made their points and we're going around in circles at this point. This thread is now further fueling the needless hostility on this site. As owner, I'm making an executive decision to lock this thread. If you have any questions about how this rule has changed and what it means for you, feel free to contact an admin.