Promotions

Just Matt Now

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We need to come up with a detailed chart from ranking up from prospect to Enforcer, from Enforcer to Captain, and from Captain to Underlord.

I suggest that from prospect to Enforcer, a player must make five contacts, aka meeting five other Cartel members. completing three missions, and having at least two running operations. Operations meaning start-ups for business ventures such as starting up a slave trade or drug ring on a specific world.

Thoughts?
 

Gaja

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Hmmmm, yeah. I agree we need to talk about it, but when it comes to promotions I'm not sure whether or not we should use the format you described. Just looking for a mission count seems like a bad way to go about it.

I'm looking for someone the Cartel can rely on. Activity, men. But IC presence, growth and IC adventures sound like a good requirment to start.
 

Cassanova

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Rule 1 of promotions; never ever quantify.

You do that you get things like Nor'baal just doing half-assed threads, grinding to the next rank. Its pitiful, pointless, and completely undermines the point of RPing a story.
 

Just Matt Now

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Alright, makes sense. How about having them own and run two to three operations that benefit the Cartel? This way it is more generalized and they will need to complete multiple threads in order to get their operations running.
 

Cassanova

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Be vague

In order to attain a promotion, your character must be able to demonstrate (in quantities suitable to the rank to which they wish to be promoted) the following criteria:
  • Must be able to provide evidence to state that they have made noted contributions to the Hutt Cartel, its subsidiaries and their operations.
  • Must be able to provide sufficient evidence that they understand the Cartel's hierarchy and are aware of key players within the organisation.
  • Is a helpful, and contributing member off the Hutt Cartel OOCly; mission participation & submission.
  • Is welcoming to new members and assists with their settling into the faction.

But its always horrible to put a number next to anything, because then you have to give a promotion to someone who really doesn't understand what the next rank is there for, or merely are doing it just to rank grind to pander their egos.

Essentially you want to be promoting people who not only want it, but are willing to work for it and are genuinely interested in bettering the faction from within.
 

Just Matt Now

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Wow, you are the man Cassa. And you're right, I was trying to be general, but stlll had a nuber in my head. Your's is vague but still has a direction. And I like the bit about the OOC, maybe we can throw in NPCing for the bounties as to aid in that section.
 

Brandon Rhea

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But its always horrible to put a number next to anything, because then you have to give a promotion to someone who really doesn't understand what the next rank is there for, or merely are doing it just to rank grind to pander their egos.
Not really. There’s nothing wrong with telling someone specifically what they need to do in order to earn their next rank. You can’t just leave people guessing. If someone is going to apply for promotion, then they should know when it is that they can actually apply.

None of that means that you have to give someone the rank just because they met the numbers. You wouldn't want to say "Complete five threads," but you could say something like "Complete five faction-approved missions." If there’s something wrong with the missions that were completed, then that’s not necessarily the fault of the RPer. After all, the leadership would’ve approved the mission beforehand. So you don't need to be vague about numbers. You just need to be more specific about what those threads are.

As for what Cass said about "understand the hiearchy," "help in the OOC," "welcome new members," etc. those are OK but not as actual public guidelines. As public guidelines, those are a lot of words to say virtually nothing of public value. Those sorts of things are what you can use internally to make your final decision, if you feel the need to use those sorts of things. I agree that just because someone hits the number of required threads doesn't mean they're necessarily ready, but you still need to be specific to tell them what they need to do to rank up while keeping the more gut feeling stuff as internal guidelines.

Here's a good idea as to what promotion guidelines can look like: http://www.thestarwarsrp.com/forum/showthread.php?51649-Sith-Promotion-Requirements. Very basic and very straight-forward, which is what promotion guidelines should be. Then, the leadership gets to make the final decision about whether those requirements were met in a satisfactory and promotion-earning way.
 

Just Matt Now

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The Sith promotion thread is actually what I initially had in mind when thinking about this, though I do like the OOC aspect. Especially since it is a new faction,and we need more people to participate willingly. This might get their attention to want to do more for the faction and express their thoughts and feelings as to what we could add or do.
 

Brandon Rhea

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It's not a bad idea, but it also makes it dependent on other people. Whereas ranking up should be about what the RPer can do, being willing to help in the OOC board can only go so far. In order to do that, there needs to be people to help. That may not always be the case.
 

Just Matt Now

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Alright so I feel that we really need to get this into motion asap, and this is not really an area that I have experience in. So much like before, I'm just going to throw something out there and see if it bites. I'm gunna start with what Cassa was saying because I like the idea of promoting from within.


In order to attain a promotion, your character must be able to demonstrate (in quantities suitable to the rank to which they wish to be promoted) the following criteria:
  • Must be able to provide evidence and links to state that they have made noted contributions to the Hutt Cartel, its subsidiaries and their operations.
  • Must be able to provide sufficient evidence that they understand that whatever operation they are earning credits from, also belongs to the Cartel, and any decision made about the operation must be in favor of the Cartel in all circumstances.
  • Must be able to provide sufficient evidence that they understand the Cartel's hierarchy and are aware of key players within the organization.
  • Is a helpful, and contributing member off the Hutt Cartel OOCly; mission participation & submission.
    Is welcoming to new members and assists with their settling into the faction.
 

Gaja

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Hmmmm, those are all fine and dandy but I tend to lean in Bac's direction when talking about this subject.

What are we going to tell the members? What do they need to do in order to advance. Does being insanely active OOC and hosting mediocre missions put your above someone who only like to RP and is a fantastic RPer and leader.

Does experience and IC recognition matter? Does a higher ranked character need to support you?

Kind of like vouching for a new member. Imagine Jack vouching for Borga [though that may not be a perfect example because Borga is a Hutt but you get the idea], of Yuri vouching for Guy.

I like the things that have been said so far but if we're looking at good examples of how a promotion thread was done, I believe the Jedi did it really well in the first part of this time line. 1 - A member has to do at least 3 factions jobs; 2 - They need to prove their loyalty to the faction; 3 - They need at least two higher ranked character to vouch for them [the third one I came up with on the fly, as it's something that I kind of like for the Cartel].
 

Just Matt Now

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Hmmm, I actually do like that idea of vouching for them. Prospects need at least one Captain to vouch for them, they would obtain this by doing whatever necessary by said Captain, sharing their profits, letting them in on their operations, but most of all, getting those operations to be profitable. The Prospect begins an must begin an operation and keep up with it, they go to a Captain who either rejects or denies him. They work out whatever deals they have between the two, and amongst other things, like say 4 missions and 2 bounties, they are promoted.

From Enforcer to Captain, they will need two Captains vouching for them, which means more and bigger operations. which is another word for making money, and have completed 5 more missions and 3 more bounties.
 

Wit

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I like the vouching idea as well. Nice one Gaja!
 

Gaja

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Ok so I think we're moving in the right direction here. Will see about putting a list together tonight to see if we can't come up with a good draft that could eventually go out in to the public.
 

Gaja

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Hmmm, I actually do like that idea of vouching for them. Prospects need at least one Captain to vouch for them, they would obtain this by doing whatever necessary by said Captain, sharing their profits, letting them in on their operations, but most of all, getting those operations to be profitable. The Prospect begins an must begin an operation and keep up with it, they go to a Captain who either rejects or denies him. They work out whatever deals they have between the two, and amongst other things, like say 4 missions and 2 bounties, they are promoted.

From Enforcer to Captain, they will need two Captains vouching for them, which means more and bigger operations. which is another word for making money, and have completed 5 more missions and 3 more bounties.
I like the vouching idea as well. Nice one Gaja!
Thanks guys.

So to try and summarize everything.

In order for a character to advance from 'Prospect' to 'Enforcer' a character needs to:
  • Provide all the threads his or her character did as a member of this faction [and provide short descriptions of said threads so that the staff has an idea of what's going on]
  • Provide/point out links to at least 3 Cartel jobs the PC did.
  • Share with us what his character thinks of the Cartel and how he's proven his loyalty to the faction
  • Also must have at least one Captain ranked PC vouch for him/her.


Getting there?
 

Gaja

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While it's similar to the Jedi, it's got our own flavor to it. Vouching for someone is important because it carries with it IC implications. With the Jedi there's always that risk that a Jedi may go 'Dark side' on us, fails a missions and no one is held accountable for that. And while that risk exists here as well, vouching for someone here carries a risk for the person who vouched because now people will look at you [if you vouched] if something happens and the promoted person either fails a job or leaves, and you'll have to do something about it.

Either get a job done, or find and kill him. Of course this would be pure IC cosmetics, and we wouldn't force anyone to do threads they don't want to do, but I think it's a good concept for a mafia faction like the Cartel.
 

Just Matt Now

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Absolutely. I can see it playing out well. Borga forcing his vouchee to take more missions and threaten him and his family. Borga dont play no games.
 

Cassanova

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I support this.
Similarly, to rank from Enforcer to Captain you should have either 2 Captain's endorsing it (or 1 Underlord).
And more threads n stuff. n things. n stuff.
 

Brandon Rhea

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Thanks guys.

So to try and summarize everything.

In order for a character to advance from 'Prospect' to 'Enforcer' a character needs to:
  • Provide all the threads his or her character did as a member of this faction [and provide short descriptions of said threads so that the staff has an idea of what's going on]
  • Provide/point out links to at least 3 Cartel jobs the PC did.
  • Share with us what his character thinks of the Cartel and how he's proven his loyalty to the faction
  • Also must have at least one Captain ranked PC vouch for him/her.


Getting there?
Much better!

As for the captain ranked PC vouching, is that only captains, or captains and above? How does that vouching work? Does that higher ranked person nominate them? Can you guys nominate people too, thereby cutting out the middlemen in certain cases?
 
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