Icebergs in sight!

[Lillianne Crasse]

this is turning into a debate about whether or not Global Warming exists or not. Perhaps it should be moved. Admins?

 

[Empress]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Kalin Morne @ Nov 17 2006, 09:27 PM) [snapback]130826[/snapback]</div>

You just proved my point. Those changes took hundreds or thousands of years. These have become highly noticable in less than a century.
[/b]

what point? there is always drastic fluctuations that happen in a decade, most have bbeen recorded through history, and in older times the ancients associated them with more things of faith but none the less..

so a trend thats been building for a few hundred years fluxing off and on as it does whatever it's doing

so there is no 100% proof one or the other but I tend to put more stock into the enviorments own powerr just because of whet I spent so many years at uni, and having to be forced to learn how to " picture" climates based off old vegitation roots, soil and dirt types etc...these fluxes have historically been common...

but then these nut jub leftests lobbiest enviormentaliests who make 90% of the repots off a limited generalization tend to NOT look 2, 300 years back, let alone 1, 2 thousand years back to see what say the greeks were writing about such events, that would be crossing fieilds and having to learn to interpurate a description and whats found " on site" rather than modern data

 

[Kalin Morne]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(The Matron @ Nov 18 2006, 03:08 AM) [snapback]130869[/snapback]</div>

what point? there is always drastic fluctuations that happen in a decade, most have bbeen recorded through history, and in older times the ancients associated them with more things of faith but none the less..

so a trend thats been building for a few hundred years fluxing off and on as it does whatever it's doing

so there is no 100% proof one or the other but I tend to put more stock into the enviorments own powerr just because of whet I spent so many years at uni, and having to be forced to learn how to " picture" climates based off old vegitation roots, soil and dirt types etc...these fluxes have historically been common...

but then these nut jub leftests lobbiest enviormentaliests who make 90% of the repots off a limited generalization tend to NOT look 2, 300 years back, let alone 1, 2 thousand years back to see what say the greeks were writing about such events, that would be crossing fieilds and having to learn to interpurate a description and whats found " on site" rather than modern data
[/b]

That's EXACTLY what these 'Nut Jobs' do. They look back and look for trends. They take accounts from historical documents from what the Greeks said, and the Romans said. That's how they know the Middle East used to be more habitable. And one of the things they take a LOT of evidence from are Winery documents about the weather. It's an unbroken chain of documentation going back five hundred years of what weather was like. And guess what? It was pretty consistent until the 1960s. And if you're saying that it's only leftist Environmentalists who believe in Global Warming, then I guess the entire scientific community are leftist environmentalist nutjobs. Because the people who say it doesn't exist are in the minority.

 

[Matt]

Moved to debate forum.

Approved by me to debate on.

So far it's be good

 

[Dexington]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Adamis / Kal'daka Kyorl @ Nov 18 2006, 01:08 AM) [snapback]130831[/snapback]</div>

Really. So you will say to some kid who gets skin cancer because you got too much UV rays when he was out walking one day because the ozone hole let more through to "suck it up, its just skin cancer"?
[/b]

No, because he has cancer. :rolleyes:

When you don't die from global warming flooding the earth, don't come crying to me. It's not gonna happen.

 

[Kalin Morne]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sen Helto @ Nov 18 2006, 10:12 AM) [snapback]130881[/snapback]</div>

No, because he has cancer. :rolleyes:

When you don't die from global warming flooding the earth, don't come crying to me. It's not gonna happen.
[/b]

That's another misconception. You have a lot of those. Global Warming doesn't result in a water world. It results in more extreme weather patterns and a 15-20 foot increase in the world's water level.

 

[Dexington]

Then what the hell is the big deal? More water to drink.

Scientists make mistakes all the time, and I think this is the biggest one yet.

 

[Kalin Morne]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sen Helto @ Nov 18 2006, 11:43 AM) [snapback]130888[/snapback]</div>

Then what the hell is the big deal? More water to drink.

Scientists make mistakes all the time, and I think this is the biggest one yet.
[/b]

You can't drink salt water readily. And say good bye to Boston, New York, Tokyo, London, San Francisco, etc etc. Most coastal cities will be under 15-20 feet of water. Also, lowlands will be completely devastated by the effects of the rise in water levels. Florida, gone. Louisiana, gone. I don't think this is a small deal, though.



However, the flooding is a very minor aspect to the effects of Global Warming. A very, very minor point. You can overcome flooding with certain life changes. However there is one thing that cannot be overcome. The change in climate. Why is the change in climate so important? Because in essence, climate determines what areas are inhabitable by man. It also determines which areas are suitable for agriculture, which determines how many people can actually eat.

 

[Darth Obsidian]

Scientific fact: global warming would cause a drop in dramatic weather patterns.
Scientific fact: there has been a drop in dramatic weather patterns.
Economic fact: the last El Nino effect caused a 19 billion net profit worldwide primarily in 3rd and 2nd world countries.
Scientific fact: the earth has just left a "mini-ice age"
Scientific fact: there was a period of 5 years were CO2 levels continued to clime however the earths temperature dropped
Scientific fact: many results from meteorlogical stations are construed by the "heat island" effect.
Scientific fact: most of Antarctica is freezing only a small percentage is melting.
Scientific fact: only a small percentage of glaciers worldwide are able to monitered.
Scientific fact: it has been discovered that many meteorlogical stations have faulty equipment all around the world. These primarily in China, Russia, and 3rd world nations.

These are things i remember from different reports i have done they are all done from memory so not everything might eb completely right. Most of my sources are from scientific papers i have read so it will likely take quite some time for me to find my references.

 

[Kalin Morne]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Darth Obsidian @ Nov 18 2006, 12:40 PM) [snapback]130898[/snapback]</div>

Scientific fact: global warming would cause a drop in dramatic weather patterns.
Scientific fact: there has been a drop in dramatic weather patterns.
Economic fact: the last El Nino effect caused a 19 billion net profit worldwide primarily in 3rd and 2nd world countries.
Scientific fact: the earth has just left a "mini-ice age"
Scientific fact: there was a period of 5 years were CO2 levels continued to clime however the earths temperature dropped
Scientific fact: many results from meteorlogical stations are construed by the "heat island" effect.
Scientific fact: most of Antarctica is freezing only a small percentage is melting.
Scientific fact: only a small percentage of glaciers worldwide are able to monitered.
Scientific fact: it has been discovered that many meteorlogical stations have faulty equipment all around the world. These primarily in China, Russia, and 3rd world nations.

These are things i remember from different reports i have done they are all done from memory so not everything might eb completely right. Most of my sources are from scientific papers i have read so it will likely take quite some time for me to find my references.
[/b]

Everything you just said I've never ever seen before. Cite sources.

 

[Dexington]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Kalin Morne @ Nov 18 2006, 12:12 PM) [snapback]130895[/snapback]</div>

However, the flooding is a very minor aspect to the effects of Global Warming. A very, very minor point. You can overcome flooding with certain life changes. However there is one thing that cannot be overcome. The change in climate. Why is the change in climate so important? Because in essence, climate determines what areas are inhabitable by man. It also determines which areas are suitable for agriculture, which determines how many people can actually eat.
[/b]

People have learned to live in very harsh conditions. Look at Fort McMurray, Alberta, one of the most prosperous cities in Canada right now, even though they are far North and under heavy snow and harsh weather almost constantly.

We would find a way to live, if that ever happened. Which I still don't think it will.

 

[Kalin Morne]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sen Helto @ Nov 18 2006, 01:04 PM) [snapback]130902[/snapback]</div>

People have learned to live in very harsh conditions. Look at Fort McMurray, Alberta, one of the most prosperous cities in Canada right now, even though they are far North and under heavy snow and harsh weather almost constantly.

We would find a way to live, if that ever happened. Which I still don't think it will.
[/b]

No one is saying humanity will die. They're saying that humanity will have to change, and if no one prepares for this, inevitable event, then many, many people WILL die.

 

[Empress]

well, I do admit things are changing, still, again It's more nature, and she has shown time and again she has a tendancy to wipe things out, and start over, or repair herself, almost all planets do unless they are totally dead


now tru even as much as a 5ft rise in ocean levels world wide will make alot of land go byby, its more the gulf stream you need to watch, make sure the belt is not slowed so much that it dropss too deep * which it has as of last ( estemated) 250 years slowly*

thought this would trigger an iceage, and screw up a few major areas, asa species humans would be fine, however economcally the world will take it up the ass

how ever the more likely events we will have to deal with are the canary islands blowing and wiping out parts of the eastern US, mainland euro, and UK, Or another major volcanic blast like yellow stone...or the subduction plate off the west coast of British Columbia/Washington/oregon/Northern Cali slipping and wiping out places like seattle ( ooh that would be sweet, give the nasty hipppies a bath)

wait.. ranier will screw up seattle too....and she's having more quakes,, Yaya death to the seattle hippies ( you have no idea how bad they are until you live in this state, they make average hippies seem....well normal)



the pole shift or super solor storm are likely in our lives too


those I'm more interested in watching for that the global warming,, which, yes it's happening, but there is still nothing conclusive one way or another that its " all man made" the scienticic world is still 50/50 on it.. soi ofcourse depending on your point of view it's easy to pull up " facts" that support is one way or another, so it's a mute point really

 

[Adamis]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sen Helto @ Nov 19 2006, 07:04 AM) [snapback]130902[/snapback]</div>

People have learned to live in very harsh conditions. Look at Fort McMurray, Alberta, one of the most prosperous cities in Canada right now, even though they are far North and under heavy snow and harsh weather almost constantly.

We would find a way to live, if that ever happened. Which I still don't think it will.
[/b]

It likely won't kill off all mankind as Kalin has said but think about all that loss of productive land? Do you really think we will be able to support our current population with all that land used for agriculture just gone?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sen Helto @ Nov 19 2006, 04:12 AM) [snapback]130881[/snapback]</div>

No, because he has cancer. :rolleyes:

When you don't die from global warming flooding the earth, don't come crying to me. It's not gonna happen.
[/b]

Well that is caused by the ozone hole. You did effectively say "So theres a ozone hole, suck it up.". Just because global flooding is the most popular consequence of the ozone hole, doesn't mean its the only one.

 

[Dexington]

He should wear sun screen then.

 

[Adamis]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sen Helto @ Nov 19 2006, 11:09 AM) [snapback]130922[/snapback]</div>

He should wear sun screen then.
[/b]

We do. It doesn't always help. There are so many UV rays coming through that you can get a bad dose of them on a overcast day and on a sunny day if you don't constantly keep slaping sun screen on you can get a bad dose in only several minutes! Hell with the hole as bad as it is even with sun screen you can still get a dose of them!!!

 

[Empress]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Adamis / Kal'daka Kyorl @ Nov 18 2006, 02:14 PM) [snapback]130924[/snapback]</div>

We do. It doesn't always help. There are so many UV rays coming through that you can get a bad dose of them on a overcast day and on a sunny day if you don't constantly keep slaping sun screen on you can get a bad dose in only several minutes! Hell with the hole as bad as it is even with sun screen you can still get a dose of them!!!
[/b]

LOL, I lived in new mexico babe, no place on earth " supposedly" has more direct UV rays that that mile high arrid desert, its a problem easily avoided by being careful and understanding how it all works
and ALL cancer is differant from person to person, we all have cancer cells, it just depends on what one persons genetic code is programmed to " activate it from" with some people its smoking, others its radiations, others is might be a certian hormone.

sure being exposed alot upps the CHANCES that that may trigger the body to react, but again the amount needed varies greatly from each person

 

[Matt]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sen Helto @ Nov 18 2006, 11:09 PM) [snapback]130922[/snapback]</div>

He should wear sun screen then.
[/b]

Is it the higher it gets the better at protecting you it is or vice versa?

Sun screen that is.

 

[Dexington]

Correct.

 

[Matt]

I'm gonna make factor 2,567,998 so no matter how hot it gets.

I'll still be my normal colour.

Fall before my supreme logic.