Dawn of the Republic: Border Alliance

[Saul]

Force users in the BA risk detracting from the importance of non-FS characters and don't help solve the paradigm of "can't fight FS without FS"

 

[Outlander]

They did in the Clone Wars. But in this timeline they have their own space, their own fleet, their own army and their own agenda. It makes sense that they will make war on the Sith, it doesn't make sense that they would prioritize the protection of the Boarder Alliance.

I think it was already said somewhere that planets the Jedi are on are protected by the Jedi. They're already defending civilian populations.

 

[Hatebackwards]

Force users in the BA risk detracting from the importance of non-FS characters and don't help solve the paradigm of "can't fight FS without FS"

By making the outcomes of battles decided only by PC's, the admins already ensured that FS characters would be incredibly important.

I think it was already said somewhere that planets the Jedi are on are protected by the Jedi. They're already defending civilian populations.

The planets they will likely be on are the Sith planets and the Jedi planets. This is a holy crusade. They are going to be striking down the hordes of the devil, not protecting civilian populations. Acting as Jedi Protectors, which is a concept that is no longer canon, would spread them far too thin for them to effectively combat the Sith.

 

[Outlander]

Do we actually know that about the Jedi? That seems kind of speculative to say they absolutely won't defend civilian populations without being in the BA.

 

[Hatebackwards]

Do we actually know that about the Jedi? That seems kind of speculative to say they absolutely won't defend civilian populations without being in the BA.

I suppose it is speculative, but I also think assuming their war with the Sith will take a backseat to their Republic loyalties is also speculative.

 

[Outlander]

I suppose it is speculative, but I also think assuming their war with the Sith will take a backseat to their Republic loyalties is also speculative.

Them being Jedi, however, isn't speculative. The Jedi have been and always will be servants of the light side of the force. And you're saying every Jedi will sit idly to the suffering of hundreds of thousands of civilians unless they happen to join the BA?

 

[Hatebackwards]

Them being Jedi, however, isn't speculative. The Jedi have been and always will be servants of the light side of the force. And you're saying every Jedi will sit idly to the suffering of hundreds of thousands of civilians unless they happen to join the BA?

They won't sit idly by, they will be attacking the Sith directly, their imperative will be to destroy the Sith. Locking themselves down on a backwater planet to defend civilians when that will put them in a strategic disadvantage, likely won't be on their top 10 list of things they want to do today.

 

[Outlander]

They won't sit idly by, they will be attacking the Sith directly, their imperative will be to destroy the Sith. Locking themselves down on a backwater planet to defend civilians when that will put them in a strategic disadvantage, likely won't be on their top 10 list of things they want to do today.

But the BA is literally the front line. If they're attacking the Sith, that's where they'll be. Nothing backwater about it. And since the Jedi are doing it independently, why have some join the BA?

 

[Hatebackwards]

But the BA is literally the front line. If they're attacking the Sith, that's where they'll be. Nothing backwater about it. And since the Jedi are doing it independently, why have some join the BA?

The BA isn't necessarily the front line for the Jedi. There is absolutely no certainty that the Jedi will chose to plant themselves in BA territory. If I were them I would take up positions in the Tion Cluster (which includes Ossus) and the Corporate Sector and hammer the Sith from behind their south westward expansion. In the meantime a lot of civilians in the Boarder Alliance are going to die. A Jedi with strong ties to Boarder Alliance worlds might feel compelled to serve in the BA military and if there are more than one, they might decide to form their own Order.

 

[Outlander]

The BA isn't necessarily the front line for the Jedi. There is absolutely no certainty that the Jedi will chose to plant themselves in BA territory. If I were them I would take up positions in the Tion Cluster (which includes Ossus) and the Corporate Sector and hammer the Sith from behind their south westward expansion. In the meantime a lot of civilians in the Boarder Alliance are going to die. A Jedi with strong ties to Boarder Alliance worlds might feel compelled to serve in the BA military and if there are more than one, they might decide to form their own Order.

Ok, I think this has gone on long enough. The final thing I'll say to the effect is one already pointed out by @Saul . The Jedi Order is the best place for Jedi for the most part. With a very single focused group like this, it doesn't make sense from and IC or OOC.

 

[Mr.BossMan]

I think the Jedi, or any FS for that matter should NOT be in the BA or Senate. My opinion but I think it is just stupid to have them.

From my experience many people tend to make FS characters just so they can be FS. Which I absolutely disdain.

 

[Silverface]

People who exclusively want the BA to awesome, PM me ideas and concepts. I'll whip something up and jam it in here, see if you all like it.

 

[Galavant]

I think the Jedi, or any FS for that matter should NOT be in the BA or Senate. My opinion but I think it is just stupid to have them.

From my experience many people tend to make FS characters just so they can be FS. Which I absolutely disdain.

I don't see why not, especially for Senate (though that's a different thread). Maybe not an active member of another Force-user faction, which wouldn't really be allowed anyone since there's no cross faction, but if they're Force-Sensitive I don't think it really matters. Force-users likewise shouldn't not be allowed in necessarily, but the fact that there's no way for them to really do their thing, get anywhere, or expand on that front within the faction will probably dissuade most. Those that it doesn't will be under heavier scrutiny from the Faction Leadership, and if they get through all that, why not? Variety is fun than, and for the space side of things it really doesn't matter all that much.

 

[Mr.BossMan]

I don't see why not, especially for Senate (though that's a different thread). Maybe not an active member of another Force-user faction, which wouldn't really be allowed anyone since there's no cross faction, but if they're Force-Sensitive I don't think it really matters. Force-users likewise shouldn't not be allowed in necessarily, but the fact that there's no way for them to really do their thing, get anywhere, or expand on that front within the faction will probably dissuade most. Those that it doesn't will be under heavier scrutiny from the Faction Leadership, and if they get through all that, why not? Variety is fun than, and for the space side of things it really doesn't matter all that much.

Ya you see I read that, I understand where your coming from, but after all that I'm still like:

No.

 

[Saul]

I don't see why not, especially for Senate (though that's a different thread). Maybe not an active member of another Force-user faction, which wouldn't really be allowed anyone since there's no cross faction, but if they're Force-Sensitive I don't think it really matters. Force-users likewise shouldn't not be allowed in necessarily, but the fact that there's no way for them to really do their thing, get anywhere, or expand on that front within the faction will probably dissuade most. Those that it doesn't will be under heavier scrutiny from the Faction Leadership, and if they get through all that, why not? Variety is fun than, and for the space side of things it really doesn't matter all that much.

Because the Jedi belong in the Jedi Order. If you want to play a Jedi in the BA, make a Jedi inside the Jedi Order, then roleplay with BA members with the consent of those members. If the BA allow Jedi to be members of the BA from the start of the timeline, then there is absolutely no need to distinguish between the two. Furthermore, the BA do not have the groundwork necessary to train, qualify, promote, or otherwise handle Jedi characters either from an IC standpoint, or OOC'ly.

Variety is not fun when it strips other characters of their agency because they become detrimentally impacted when it comes to power. It's also exceptionally difficult to balance when determining battles - ordinarily, the FL's will go "BA are the opponents of the Sacred Band of Ziost," then you start throwing Jedi into the mix and the SBZ don't have the tools to handle it, or were expecting something more fair. Then you also have Jedi characters running around using their handwaving magical voodoo spidey sense when other people who joined the BA specifically to avoid that are now forced to not only deal with it, but play second fiddle to it because it's a trump card to anything non-FS characters have.

 

[Hatebackwards]

Then you also have Jedi characters running around using their handwaving magical voodoo spidey sense when other people who joined the BA specifically to avoid that are now forced to not only deal with it, but play second fiddle to it because it's a trump card to anything non-FS characters have.

This whole timeline is going to be about person to person fighting so most people will be some variation of Boba Fett, Darth Vader, Han Solo or Luke Skywalker. When battles are determined by one on one player character fighting, variation and creativity becomes drastically limited.

Also if you have a huge problem with people role playing force users, Star Wars may not be the setting for you. At a minimum, your enemies the Sith, your allies the Jedi and any number of indie characters you encounter will be force users.

 

[Eccles]

However difficult, I'm sure FL teams will do their utmost best to find a balance. FS characters will not be a problem, FU characters might if they see themselves as better than the other BA members (which could also create interesting interactions to write out). However the rules are quite clear that you can't be in both the Jedi and the Republic main factions, and that includes having a single character being a member of both.

If you're hell bend on having your Jedi actively protect the Border Alliance worlds, might I suggest to seek out simple cooperation and social threads instead of being a fully fledged member? That way those of the BA that do not want to socialize with a Jedi General (of which I'd probably be one) can choose not to.

So there's no interest in a PM-RP? :( You people make me sad

 

[Saul]

This whole timeline is going to be about person to person fighting so most people will be some variation of Boba Fett, Darth Vader, Han Solo or Luke Skywalker. When battles are determined by one on one player character fighting, variation and creativity becomes drastically limited.

Also if you have a huge problem with people role playing force users, Star Wars may not be the setting for you. At a minimum, your enemies the Sith, your allies the Jedi and any number of indie characters you encounter will be force users.

I have no problem with Force user characters. I have tons of problems with them interacting in every day activities, missions, and the like with non-Force users who didn't sign up with the BA to do that. If they are members of the BA, then they fundamentally alter the BA's TTP (tactics, techniques and procedures) and turn it, if not completely, then at least in part into a Force-user organization. All of the roleplay ideas people who want to make Jedi in the BA can be accomplished by making Jedi in the Jedi Order then organizing threads with BA characters, while gaining the additional benefit of being able to be trained, certified as whatever rank Jedi (because the BA cannot say you actually qualify to be however powerful), and being able to join battles against similarly equipped foes (which decreases the chance that you have to deal with sonic weaponry or shotguns or the like).

And, no the NTL isn't just about PvP among heroic figures; it's not going to be anymore about PvP than the current timeline, the alterations to the system are designed to encourage new people to fight battles rather than the same people every time. The suggestion that the only way to approach combat against other real players is by designing overpowered characters is very shallow and discredits people that prefer to rely on RP quality rather than "lolbeskar darksaber flamethrowers and force pushes."

 

[Loco]

This whole timeline is going to be about person to person fighting so most people will be some variation of Boba Fett, Darth Vader, Han Solo or Luke Skywalker. When battles are determined by one on one player character fighting, variation and creativity becomes drastically limited.

We've been using this same system for about six months now and this hasn't been a problem in any way, shape, or form, so I'm not sure why it would suddenly become one now.

 

[Hatebackwards]

If they are members of the BA, then they fundamentally alter the BA's TTP (tactics, techniques and procedures) and turn it, if not completely, then at least in part into a Force-user organization.

No one should be role playing a Jedi Knight level character in a way that alter the face of the entire battlefield. I think Kanan in Rebels is a good gauge of Jedi Knight skill level.

The suggestion that the only way to approach combat against other real players is by designing overpowered characters is very shallow and discredits people that prefer to rely on RP quality

I wasn't suggesting that people do it, I am suggesting that human nature will lead people to do exactly that.

-

And, no the NTL isn't just about PvP among heroic figures; it's not going to be anymore about PvP than the current timeline

We've been using this same system for about six months now and this hasn't been a problem in any way, shape, or form, so I'm not sure why it would suddenly become one now.

I predict that people are going to be more into the next timeline and are going to be more interested in pursuing in character agendas, such as taking territory. Unless the admins can create situations where soft skills can achieve objectives, there are going to be a lot of billy badasses.