Confirmed: Bin Laden is dead.

[Crosby]

Regardless of what he did, he was still human. If we go on to dehumanize him, we are allowing ourselves to do what terrorists must do to commit their acts. While evil, he still deserves basic dignity simply as a human being.

I don't think so, that guy was a dick.

 

[Raider]

The difference is that we aren't acting as terrorists, dehumanizing someone who didn't act human is just fine with me.

Double this.

 

[Viggy]

Regardless of what he did, he was still human. If we go on to dehumanize him, we are allowing ourselves to do what terrorists must do to commit their acts. While evil, he still deserves basic dignity simply as a human being.

It's not like his corpse is being paraded through the streets. He was given a decent burial after his religious customs. But are we supposed to pretend it's not a good thing that a horrible monster like him is gone?

 

[Random Hero]

A little off topic but I am glad to see that US Intelligence seems to have gotten their shit together.

 

[Zen]

For the record, Obama's national security adviser said today in a press conference that if they had the opportunity to capture Bin Laden alive, they probably would have. They just knew that, in all likelihood, that opportunity wasn't going to arise, because Bin Laden was going to fight to the death -- which he did.

As I said earlier in the thread, even if they went in intending to likely kill him, he was a) an enemy soldier and b) someone we all knew was going to go down fighting anyway, even if we wanted him captured.

Bin Laden was not going to fall into the hands of his enemies. Period, so all this whining about how horrible we are for killing him is absurd.



Zen, you're buying into fear and paranoia. You're saying two horribly incorrect things here:

1) People that own gas stations are not terrorists. You're essentially being racist by assuming you have to worry about them retaliating just because they look a certain way.

2) Virtually all of Bin Laden's children utterly despise him, same with his wives, so they're more than likely relieved that he's finally dead.

I apologize on my part maybe I was not thinking before I typed and posted. I should Have thought before posting. This, Sorry.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

A little off topic but I am glad to see that US Intelligence seems to have gotten their shit together.

US intelligence has had their shit together, and WikiLeaks proved that when their leaks inadvertently showed how competent and professional the intelligence community is. They may have called Iraq wrong, but they were deceived by Iraqis on the ground and Saddam Hussein himself.

 

[Ser Gregor]

Regardless of what he did, he was still human. If we go on to dehumanize him, we are allowing ourselves to do what terrorists must do to commit their acts. While evil, he still deserves basic dignity simply as a human being.

But terrorism relies on humanizing their targets as much as possible. That's why they use terror tactics on civilian populations.

 

[Random Hero]

I would like people's thoughts on the following question.

Do you believe the Pakistani government truly had no prior knowledge of Bin Laden's whereabouts?

I would like to give them the benefit of the doubt, but I am having a hard time believing it.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

I would like people's thoughts on the following question.

Do you believe the Pakistani government truly had no prior knowledge of Bin Laden's whereabouts?

I would like to give them the benefit of the doubt, but I am having a hard time believing it.

Pakistan notoriously double dips. It's like a 50/50 split in that government in terms of support. Some government officials would know, some wouldn't have known. Undoubtedly someone powerful knew.

 

[Damocles]

Must say I lol'd at /b/ though. Got Team America theme playing.

 

[Raider]

I would like people's thoughts on the following question.

Do you believe the Pakistani government truly had no prior knowledge of Bin Laden's whereabouts?

I would like to give them the benefit of the doubt, but I am having a hard time believing it.

It's almost certain that powerful people in Pakistan knew, if not then its a sign of glaring incompetence. Were they members of the government, the military, the ISI? Probably, Pakistan has been playing a double game with us for the last 10 years.

 

[Cailst]

But terrorism relies on humanizing their targets as much as possible. That's why they use terror tactics on civilian populations.

Humanizing their targets to the enemy population, not to themselves.


By the way, found this online.

[video=youtube;MxVdU2eVYSg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MxVdU2eVYSg[/video]

 

[Ols]

Great article in today's Independent from Robert Fisk. Linked here.
I know he's provoked the ire of many American conservatives in the past, but this article is pretty spot on, and even if you disagree it does raise a lot of interesting points.

 

[Kaeb]

Does this really change anything?

 

[Raider]

Does this really change anything?

It's a highly symbolic event for us in the United States, but also it'll be demoralizing to al-Quada and other jihadists. Not to mention we'll get a ton of intel from his computers and thumb drives that were seized. May speed up our departure from Afghanistan too. He is the reason we invaded in the first place.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

Great article in today's Independent from Robert Fisk. Linked here.
I know he's provoked the ire of many American conservatives in the past, but this article is pretty spot on, and even if you disagree it does raise a lot of interesting points.

These people who keep saying "We got him, let's go home" are engaging in revisionist history -- and I hate that term, that's how much I think it's true. When we want to Afghanistan, the capture of Bin Laden was one of many goals, but one that George Bush made clear as early as a few months after 9/11 wasn't the primary goal or a goal that would really change the outcome of anything.

 

[Viggy]

Great article in today's Independent from Robert Fisk. Linked here.
I know he's provoked the ire of many American conservatives in the past, but this article is pretty spot on, and even if you disagree it does raise a lot of interesting points.

If NATO-ISAF forces pulled out right now, many people would be back under Taliban rule again within weeks. The Afghan government is not even close to being ready to fight the Taliban alone. The moral obligation to defend people from Islamofascists put aside, consider our own interest here: if the Taliban took control of Afghanistan again, they would be in a strong position to shelter terrorist organizations and plan new attacks on Western countries.

We pretty much need to keep fighting until the Taliban is no more, or the new Afghan government is competent and trustworthy enough to keep the region secure on its own.

 

[Ols]

These people who keep saying "We got him, let's go home" are engaging in revisionist history -- and I hate that term, that's how much I think it's true. When we want to Afghanistan, the capture of Bin Laden was one of many goals, but one that George Bush made clear as early as a few months after 9/11 wasn't the primary goal or a goal that would really change the outcome of anything.

The article is arguing that Bin Laden's death isn't really going to change anything with regard to the Afghan war, not that America is hypocritical for not immediately beginning troop withdrawal.

 

[Ser Gregor]

Obama's decided not to release the death photos of Osama.

 

[Brandon Rhea]

Obama's decided not to release the death photos of Osama.

He probably figured it'd do more harm than good. It'd piss people off, and the people who want to believe he's not dead will just come up with a reason as to why the image is a fake -- just like the birth certificate.

You can't reason someone out of an idea if they got that idea through unreasonable means.