Battle: Raid at Balmorra

[Santoro]

Well, I'd like people to post again. Threads being held up for four days because of OOC details is a huge problem.

 

[Rameth]

Sorry about the delay, couldn't get on yesterday. I've posted and set up a posting order. This should make things a little faster. Also I am not done arguing about a few a these things, I have new valid points to make.


....tomorrow lol.

 

[Jiang Winters]

Just an FYI Rameth, MAC guns would bypass your shields. You'll need to edit your post to account for that.

 

[Santoro]

Just an FYI Rameth, MAC guns would bypass your shields. You'll need to edit your post to account for that.

Unless he has kinetic shields which I've said isn't unheard of, especially on bigger ships that the MAC cannons would target.

I'd leave it Rameth.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Unless he has kinetic shields which I've said isn't unheard of, especially on bigger ships that the MAC cannons would target.

I'd leave it Rameth.

I would agree with this (there is actual evidence on wookieepedia), and I'm sure Rameth will be on soon to explain why.

 

[Rameth]

It is said that nearly all large ships, I'm guessing anything frigate sized and above, would have particle shields, which are the shields they used to protect against physical attacks. So yes I would have defense against them.


Normally they are nerfed quite a lot because laser weapons are the main weapon. Although considering the big role that the MAC cannon plays in this RP I would assume that the particle shields are even stronger then they normally are. Otherwise every ship would be ripped to pieces within seconds.

 

[Jiang Winters]

Shields have only been around for about 20-30 years in this timeline. tbh I don't see running both ray and particle shields as being feasible for anything but very big ships, because our primitive shield tech would be less power efficient and so only big ships would have the power to run both shields at any sort of useful capacity without draining from other systems. It's also a balance thing; if you raise particle shields, you're safe from ballistics [kinda] but weakened against energy, whereas you raise ray shields and you're safe from energy weapons but not from projectiles. That's how most smaller [Cruisers and below] Rep and Hutt ships should work, imo.

 

[Santoro]

Shields have only been around for about 20-30 years in this timeline. tbh I don't see running both ray and particle shields as being feasible for anything but very big ships, because our primitive shield tech would be less power efficient and so only big ships would have the power to run both shields at any sort of useful capacity without draining from other systems. It's also a balance thing; if you raise particle shields, you're safe from ballistics [kinda] but weakened against energy, whereas you raise ray shields and you're safe from energy weapons but not from projectiles. That's how most smaller [Cruisers and below] Rep and Hutt ships should work, imo.

The ships are hot-off-the-line, and as the history says most weapons are kinetic. Given, we're military and would expect energy, the fact of the matter having no kinetic shields active would be stupid.

Essentially, you're putting a gun there that we weren't informed of (previous administration or not, nowhere is it posted), can't dodge, and can't avoid. Damn, I really need some unavoidable one hit guns!

I'm fine with the guns being there, that makes sense and is all hunky-dory. Having them rip apart the newly arrived fleet is just silly- if you want this war to continue on stupid no-impact planets then thats what we can do, but it's getting nowhere. If you want it to be exciting then we need to cut back on the bickering and let roleplay happen.

 

[Jiang Winters]

Can you stow the attitude, Santoro? I've done nothing to deserve it, and the last few arguments we've had, you've been doing all the bickering and tbh I'm getting very tired of it. I've always been happy to co-operate with you and talk things through, so to try to call me out on 'bickering' and 'arguments' and what-have-you when you haven't so much as made an effort to contact me is a load of crock.

Secondly, the defenses and ship threads are posted in the Republic's secure boards. As I said before, we'd happily reveal defenses and fleet numbers and whatnot if anybody bothered to do some proper recon and espionage threads.

This is all very rich coming from you after you one-shotted our defenses on Coruscant with the senate thread by failing to notify any potential opposition, and then trying to one-shot the defenses again with your latest infiltration thread which I actually bothered to try to get defenses into, only for you to start whining and scrap the whole thing when you couldn't just instantly slip in.

Now, as for the ships; if I were you, I'd have just made the argument that as the Republic's heavier ships and defenses prefer kinetic weapons, then it'd be logical for the Hutt ships to arrive with particle shields up rather than ray shields. It's a perfectly reasonable assumption for your ships to make. I do think that having one-size-fits-all shielding is silly save for dreadnought-sized ships; having to pick between kinetic shielding and energy shielding is a good way to maintain a balance and keep both sides on their toes.

Again, if you want to 'cut back on the bickering' then stop running around doing your own thing and start talking to the other faction leaders in this RP and try to organize things. I can understand surprise attacks and the like occuring with no co-ordination save for a recruitment thread here and there, but when you have a problem with what someone else is doing, try talking to them. You'll find that a lot of your problems go away.

---

In the interests of keeping this from devolving into an endless cycle of bickering, please keep all chatter from this point on related to the thread topic. If anyone has any problems not related to the thread, PM me or another admin please.

 

[Santoro]

You knew about the Sound of Success/Lend Me Your Ears thread way ahead of time and approved it. I notified you, and you were aware of our second espionage attempt, as was the S13 leader- who else am I supposed to inform if not the leaders of the two opposing factions?

Hidden board defenses are a lame cop-out. Even so, I accept their presence (and note that it should be made public for future reference, as planetary defenses wouldn't be 'hidden'). If we're going to point the finger at me for trying to 'slide by' then we should probably mention that. The Hutts go out of our way to make it clear what we've got.

Two types of shielding isn't unreasonable. If the Hutts were aware that the Republic used both types then they'd put everything they could into countering. The Hutts are few in numbers and can't afford to play rock-paper-scissors with their vessels, so the ones they field would have to count and survive past the first twelve seconds.

I go about doing my own thing because I was under the impression that was the responsibility of a faction leader. I'm coordinating with my faction to launch threads and have actually contacted other faction leaders to plan something, none of which came to fruition. As you say, if you have a problem with what I'm doing then let me know. I'm not actively trying to step on toes or piss people off, I'm trying to keep interest in this timeline, and when every thread I try to launch gets shot down for BS reasons then yes, I'll get an attitude. In the last thread, I actually went out of my way to give the Republic a chance to intervene (and yes, both Republic and S13 knew it was coming), but instead I was told it couldn't happen so I scrapped the thread in lieu of a coming replacement. I'm doing my best to make everyone happy here, but all I'm getting is 'no, no, no', so let me know what exactly I should be doing if not making new threads.

 

[Jiang Winters]

I knew of the mission's ultimate intent, and I also authorized you to put Hutt speakers in the Senate hall and just say that they passed the security check. You do have a valid point in that you notified us, in a way, of the missions, but we never received links to any of the threads. It was luck that we stumbled across them. That said, by 'notify', I meant make it clear in the threads that defenders are welcome to join and to post a notice 'hey, let's get some defenders in this thread' inside the Republic's boards. [We could do the latter though, so that's a failure on my part.] To be fair though, I had to contact you over the second espionage thread. You never really worked with us on that. You also ignored all the suggestions and alternates I gave, so you can't really blame us for causing that plan to fail. I tried to accommodate your plan and make it work, but oh well. It's all in the past I guess.

Going back to the shielding, I'm going to stick to my guns here and say that shield tech just should not be advanced enough yet for any ship smaller than a battleship/dreadnought to run two sets of shields at the same time. The power drain would be phenomenal and our technology is nowhere near as advanced as it would be in the KOTOR or RTOJ eras. We just shouldn't be able to do it - neither side should. [This may seem convenient for the projectile-heavy Rep, but it's not. If anything it'll make Hutt fighters more effective against Rep capital ships because bombs/torpedos will bypass ray shields, and if the Rep ships try to counter those weapons, then the Hutt capital ships gun them down with turbolasers.]

You are right to a degree about some of our defenses. We should have a list of our harder-to-hide defenses kicking around publicly. I feel that each faction should have its secrets though, as it makes metagaming when choosing a target impossible and it forces each side to use recon threads to gather intel about local defenses and the like, giving factions like Darksaber and SOLAG/S13 missions to fight in, on a whole making for far more interesting, intelligent roleplay.

I don't really see where you're coming from about your threads being 'shot down for BS reasons'. The only thread I've ever actually said 'whoa, hang on a sec' to was your second infiltration thread, and that was just because I saw something that I felt wouldn't work. However, I contacted you and tried to work out a way to get that thread back on track and to get it to work how you wanted to. I tried to make that thread work - you're the one who let it fail.

Anyways, arguments aside before tensions start brewing, 'cuz I know I've been more irritable here the last two days. So quasi-compliment time to ease the tension. >:3

I'll be honest here - you're doing a fantastic job as Hutt faction leader. The faction has never been more active, and the co-ordination thing isn't something you should fret over - it doesn't just affect you, it bites all of the faction leaders, myself included. Perhaps the whole reason that there's been so much bickering here lately is because people are still getting used to school and they're still getting used to having to balance pleasure time with school time. That said, you've been putting together a lot of missions that have tremendous potential, and again, I've only ever seen one really go to pot and that was your second infiltration thread. Well, and maybe that one thread where Val and Caed and Cedo got into it but that doesn't count...

 

[Rameth]

Going back to the shielding, I'm going to stick to my guns here and say that shield tech just should not be advanced enough yet for any ship smaller than a battleship/dreadnought to run two sets of shields at the same time. The power drain would be phenomenal and our technology is nowhere near as advanced as it would be in the KOTOR or RTOJ eras. We just shouldn't be able to do it - neither side should. [This may seem convenient for the projectile-heavy Rep, but it's not. If anything it'll make Hutt fighters more effective against Rep capital ships because bombs/torpedos will bypass ray shields, and if the Rep ships try to counter those weapons, then the Hutt capital ships gun them down with turbolasers.]

On this site there are standard lightsabers, personal shields, HUGE ships (for the time), turbolasers, MAC cannons, shields for ships and I'm sure a few more things I haven't got around to noticing. Now you guys have made exception for all of those things but having two shields up at the same time is pushing it? C'mon.

Secondly just switching shields wouldn't work. It would only make both sides at a disadvantage and make battles extremely short. All the republic would need to do is fire its MAC guns, or whatever it is you guys have on your ships, and have two or three cruisers in the back pelting us with turbolasers. We would have to decide on getting destroyed by projectiles or lasers.

It would also work the other way around, something you noted. Because the Hutts use mostly lasers the Republic would have their ray shields up during most conflicts. Well if, lets say the Malice gunship, released a full barrage of Assault Concussion Missiles at one of the Republic ships it would be forced to switch shields and be probably destroyed by the other ships turbolasers. The Hutts could use this tactic to destroy each ship one by one. Having both shields makes more sense.

Regardless, the MAC cannons are definitively the bigger threat so it would make sense for use to come with those shields up, if its actually decided that we only have one up at a time.

 

[Gambler]

You know what, I'm too tired for this. All of this OOC bickering and brown nosing is getting old. How about we keep this clean? The people in the actual thread will go through with their thread, while the rest of us wait on the sidelines and, instead of acting like bat shit insane fanatics, we watch. If Cailst has a problem with something Rameth posts, let Cailst address the issue. If Rameth has a problem with some Cailst posts, let Rameth address the issue. Every single OOC thread has retrogressed into bitchfest after bitchfest. I was under the impression that without Caged all of that drama would be over with, but I guess I was wrong. Way to go back to middle school, guys, you have the mentality of sixth graders with the vocabulary of adults. Awesome. Maybe your teacher will give you a cookie for the effort.

Now, this thread was started what, a week ago? More? It is supposed to be a simple raid. Drop some bombs, scramble communications, and gtfo before reinforcements have a chance to be deployed. Where's the complication? The Republic forces on the planet will be putting their backs up and digging in for a siege, caught off guard by the attack so close to home. The Hutts haven't begun hitting the Colony worlds yet, so why would Core worlds be worried about being hit? And if the defenses are a result of the Alsakan Crisis, then they would be outdated. Twenty years outdated.

As to the notification business, why should the factions be given that much forewarning? A raid is a raid, a very small scale attack that will hardly land any casualties on either side. The infiltration mission? Some idiot would use that knowledge and enter the thread prepared for everything. The coordination is all fine and dandy when it comes to full scale battles, but otherwise it opens the doorway to metagaming. I doubt that anyone in this thread is guilty of that, but there are people who would take the opportunity for whatever reason.

Santoro and Hakim, I don't want to see either of you interfering in this thread anymore, alright? Neither of you are directly involved in it, so there's no reason for you to post here except to further your argument. Sure, you're the faction leaders coordinating the attack/defense, but that boils down to coaching from the sidelines. It's the player's choice to take or ignore the advice. Cailst, Rameth, and whoever else is joining the thread on either side, it's your job to see this thread through to the end.

What's the point of this thread if it becomes a Keanu-Caged bitchfest?

Before anyone replies directly to me, know that I won't be replying again until the raid is completed. If you guys choose to bitch and moan about every little detail, then this will never get done. However, if you allow events to run their course and decide the battle through Rameth and Cailst's roleplaying, then the thread will progress much faster. Everyone has something planned for the conclusion of this thread, both sides are semi-aware of those plans, so why clutter this thread with useless drama?

 

[Jake]

EDIT: Ragh, never mind. :[

Why do you two argue over petty shit constantly? D:

 

[Tsar Fire]

Again, I say this. It's a Star wars RP. Don't get all scientific, remember it's a game to have fun with, and go. PEW PEW Lasers and Shields. Fighters pow pow lasers.

Ok. Calm down a bit and just RP it. Long range instakill MAC guns is Godmoding. Invulnerable deflector shields is also God-moding. So we just call them both off, trade blows, and have fun.

There is no need for all the "science" that people argue about in space battles. It's star wars for pete's sake. There is no need to take it sooooo seriously.


"Again the core planets have an extra defence. Orbital bombard cannons, relying on magnetic acceleration coils, fire slugs of massive displacement into battle lines of enemy ships, able to rip a hole into a modest sized ship. Of course, these guns are a rarity, and only used if necessary. "

Taken directly from that hidden faction info. These guns are a rarity. That should allow us to say that there are not walls of MAC guns orbiting this planet.

Now we ought to move on and let them RP.
Can't we all just be friends while we kill each other?

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Right then.

Well my post will be coming either tonight or tomorrow. Currently I am swamped with a few things from school (Computer program, Geo lab report, other hw), so that is slowing me down quite a bit.

Just wanted to post that I am aware it is my turn.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Posted.

 

[Rameth]

I would just like to add that the word Taung has been thrown around a lot during the thread. I just want to make it clear that the Republic doesn't know that the Taung are leading this attack or that they are even involved. Just wanted to make that little tid bit known, no need to change anything or whatever.

 

[Cailst]

I would just like to add that the word Taung has been thrown around a lot during the thread. I just want to make it clear that the Republic doesn't know that the Taung are leading this attack or that they are even involved. Just wanted to make that little tid bit known, no need to change anything or whatever.

So far, none of the NPCs have referred to the Taung as Taung, just an omniscient narrator so far.

 

[Rameth]

So far, none of the NPCs have referred to the Taung as Taung, just an omniscient narrator so far.

Exactly lol. Just felt like it had to be said.