Black lives matter

BLADE

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and a return of Neapolitan to power

Neapolitan.jpg


History repeats itself... first as tragedy and then as dessert.
 

Mr.BossMan

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Ya, spray painting those statues was pretty petty.

Then again I'm more in the #BlueLivesMatter and #AllLivesMatter side of this conflict.

I say this to simply combat #BlackLivesMatter which, to me, is a completely ridiculous movement.
 

Outlander

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Extremism. It happens in every single movement. And it sucks, but I think the movement itself has a good purpose. Yeah, we have race issues in the states, and they need to be addressed. I think this is what a lot of people in the movement think, and believing they're being discriminated against by police isn't an unjustified attitude. It's not grounds to deface property, attack people, or kill cops, but like I said, that's the radical element present in all movements.
 

Cainhurst Crow

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I find the logic somewhat funny, in a grim sorta way. A few bad cops, essentially the extremists you speak of, are enough to indicate that not only do all police take part in systematic, targeted attacks against people of a darker skin color then manila, but that all of society and every white person in it harbors some subconscious command to hate black people and keep them down, with no empirical evidence to back it up.

Meanwhile, the number of these extremists cases continues to be steady within the movement, and people suddenly are able to differentiate between what is a rogue element and what is a norm for a disorganized group with no leader and no command structure, and no litmus test for who is or isn't a member. Sorry, to me that sounds way too much like gamergate mumble jumble for me to take seriously.
 

Outlander

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I find the logic somewhat funny, in a grim sorta way. A few bad cops, essentially the extremists you speak of, are enough to indicate that not only do all police take part in systematic, targeted attacks against people of a darker skin color then manila, but that all of society and every white person in it harbors some subconscious command to hate black people and keep them down, with no empirical evidence to back it up.

Meanwhile, the number of these extremists cases continues to be steady within the movement, and people suddenly are able to differentiate between what is a rogue element and what is a norm for a disorganized group with no leader and no command structure, and no litmus test for who is or isn't a member. Sorry, to me that sounds way too much like gamergate mumble jumble for me to take seriously.

Let me rephrase what I said. SOME police. SOME Police and SOME members of the BLA Movement.
 

Mr.BossMan

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Yes, extremist seem to be all over this movement.

From when they chant "Pigs in a blanket, Fry 'em like bacon!" in Minnesota.

To when they chant "What do we want? Dead cops! When do we want them? Now!" in New York City.

To when they shut down entire highways by standing in them. Stoping traffic and others from going to where they need to go. Also preventing trains from leaving their stations.

To the riots in Baltimore, Ferguson and everywhere else.

To the constant looting and vandalism of businesses and statues (Like the ones Benvenu linked in the opening post.)

To the constant use of intimidation and scare tactics used by the organization.


BlackLivesMatter is a joke. It's wrong and quite honestly its disgusting.
 

Outlander

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Yes, extremist seem to be all over this movement.

From when they chant "Pigs in a blanket, Fry 'em like bacon!" in Minnesota.

To when they chant "What do we want? Dead cops! When do we want them? Now!" in New York City.

To when they shut down entire highways by standing in them. Stoping traffic and others from going to where they need to go. Also preventing trains from leaving their stations.

To the riots in Baltimore, Ferguson and everywhere else.

To the constant looting and vandalism of businesses and statues (Like the ones Benvenu linked in the opening post.)

To the constant use of intimidation and scare tactics used by the organization.


BlackLivesMatter is a joke. It's wrong and quite honestly its disgusting.

Yeah, a lot of shitty extremism happens in the movement. But that's just a part of this movement. Like, I said, every movement for social change has these extremist.

For example, the Dallas Shootings. 800 peaceful protestors rallying for a cause which was ruined by an extremist.
 

Mr.BossMan

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When something constantly shows signs of extremism, over time that's what it becomes. Much like what we see with BLM, as it is slowly becoming more and more aggressive.

What are they even protesting? Black people being shot by police? More whites have been shot by police officers than blacks. You do not see whites rioting in the streets because of this.

"White Privilege?" Which is a complete joke.

Systematic racism? Which simply doesn't exist.

Black Lives Matter is simply trying to make a problem out of nothing.
 

Outlander

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When something constantly shows signs of extremism, over time that's what it becomes. Much like what we see with BLM, as it is slowly becoming more and more aggressive.

What are they even protesting? Black people being shot by police? More whites have been shot by police officers than blacks. You do not see whites rioting in the streets because of this.

"White Privilege?" Which is a complete joke.

Systematic racism? Which simply doesn't exist.

Black Lives Matter is simply trying to make a problem out of nothing.

Systemic Racism doesn't exist?

Yeah, I have no idea where you're getting your statistics from, but systemic racism is definitely a real thing. Hell, the desegregation of schools is something that many, many people still remember, and removing the sort of attitude that causes that is something that takes a long time.
 

Mr.BossMan

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Systemic Racism doesn't exist?

Yeah, I have no idea where you're getting your statistics from, but systemic racism is definitely a real thing. Hell, the desegregation of schools is something that many, many people still remember, and removing the sort of attitude that causes that is something that takes a long time.

I say systematic racism doesn't exist, and you bring up something that was outlawed in 1954.

Also, you know what I meant. I meant It does not exist in America, today. So don't try and use past events to justify your opinions for current ones.
 

Outlander

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I say systematic racism doesn't exist, and you bring up something that was outlawed in 1954.

Also, you know what I meant. I meant It does not exist in America, today. So don't try and use past events to justify your opinions for current ones.

I'm saying systemic racism is something that takes time to eliminate. More than a single, or even several, generations. Those are deeply ingrained ideas.

We can see the effects of it now. Just look back to the ferguson riots. A police force that was almost entirely white in a community where the majority was African American. After the whole thing kicked off, it came out that the police chief had specifically targeted african americans (With some horrifying quotes like "Let's make the jail more colorful." And "Let's have a black day") as well as police brutality against unarmed prisoners on minor charges. And that's not an isolated incident; some of the shootings and incidents we've seen after that have shown that. And that's not just with the police; anti-fraud voting laws are designed to keep minorities from voting, as they require a document that many African Americans don't have, with only something like three actual cases of fraud over a long period of time as justification. And looking further still we the unconscious prejudices it's even harder to see. Like a 2012 study showing that two thirds of medical professionals have unconscious biases against African American patients.

Yes, Systemic Racism is still very much alive.
 

Cainhurst Crow

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Here's the thing, the evidence for "systematic racism" existing in the modern united states appears to fall into 3 circumstances. Circumstantial, Tangential, and Minimal. The evidence usually cites the laws that were already abolished by the Supreme Court (Tangential), a person being shot who was a criminal who may or may not have been actively posing a threat to police officers/others (Circumstantial), and citing single case studies that demonstrate an individuals actions rather then a societies actions, or single surveys which cover only a small sample and most of which haven't been peer reviewed (Minimal).
 

Outlander

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Here's the thing, the evidence for "systematic racism" existing in the modern united states appears to fall into 3 circumstances. Circumstantial, Tangential, and Minimal. The evidence usually cites the laws that were already abolished by the Supreme Court (Tangential), a person being shot who was a criminal who may or may not have been actively posing a threat to police officers/others (Circumstantial), and citing single case studies or single surveys, most of which haven't been peer reviewed (Minimal).

Oh no. Anti-fraud laws are still around, and are very prominent.

Like, for example, the case of a Georgia man who was on the ground attempting to help a mental patient who posed no threat that was shot twice?

You mean, for example, government census showing that over 40% of inmates are African American?
 

dblue095

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Black men are 3 times more likely to go to jail than white men.
 

Mr.BossMan

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"Institutional racism or systemic racism describes forms of racism which are structured into political and social institutions. It occurs when organisations, institutions or governments discriminate, either deliberately or indirectly, against certain groups of people to limit their rights." - Definition according to the all mighty Google

I'm saying systemic racism is something that takes time to eliminate. More than a single, or even several, generations. Those are deeply ingrained ideas.

We can see the effects of it now. Just look back to the ferguson riots. A police force that was almost entirely white in a community where the majority was African American.
This is not racism. Just because cops are white does not mean that society is racist towards blacks. Nothing is stopping black men and women from becoming a police officer so they can police their own communities. The only thing a majority white police department shows is that more white's like to be police officers than blacks. There is nothing wrong with that nor is that racist.

After the whole thing kicked off, it came out that the police chief had specifically targeted african americans (With some horrifying quotes like "Let's make the jail more colorful." And "Let's have a black day") as well as police brutality against unarmed prisoners on minor charges.

Your're gonna have to link me to the source on this one. I find this highly unlikely and I can almost guarantee this is a liberal news feed, trying to add to the problem in ferguson. Also I find it only logical to target African Americans, seems how they were the people most involved with the riots and the protest. Like you said above, it was a mostly black community. So it can't be far off to assume that most of the crime was caused by blacks. This is not racist, it is simply reasonable.

Although if you link me to the source of your information and I find it credible than yes, I will agree that the police chief made racist comments.


And that's not an isolated incident; some of the shootings and incidents we've seen after that have shown that. And that's not just with the police; anti-fraud voting laws are designed to keep minorities from voting, as they require a document that many African Americans don't have, with only something like three actual cases of fraud over a long period of time as justification.

All that was required for the voter laws was a simple ID. Something to prove that you are the person you claim to be. This would help prevent people from voting more than once, or using the same ID over and over again for different people. That's not racist it's just common sense. If you didn't have your ID you could do any number of things, a utility bill would of worked, or you could simply come back with your ID if you lost it or something.

That's not racism.

And looking further still we the unconscious prejudices it's even harder to see. Like a 2012 study showing that two thirds of medical professionals have unconscious biases against African American patients.

I have never heard of this study but if you could show it to me that's be great. That being said, this hardly proves systemic racism. To me this sounds like racial biases of individuals, not society.

Yes, Systemic Racism is still very much alive.

No it isn't.

You mean, for example, government census showing that over 40% of inmates are African American?

Who's problem is that? The governments? Just because a majority of criminals are black does not mean Institutional Racism exist. If you commit a crime, you go to jail, if you commit a sever enough crime you go to prison. Blacks commit crime, just like every other race, and thus they go to jail for it.

Are you saying we shouldn't arrest blacks?
 

Mr.BossMan

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Black men are 3 times more likely to go to jail than white men.

Actually, they're 3.5 times more likely.

Blacks only represent 12-13 percent of the American population. While white's represent 63 percent (I'm pretty sure) of the population. So at first glance it seems pretty unfair that a minority group is 3.5 times more likely to go to jail than a majority group. However according to the DOJ (Department of Justice) blacks commit a disproportionate amount of crime. Here's the quote:

"Despite making up just 13% of the population, blacks committed half of homicides in the United States for nearly 30 years. DOJ statistics show that between 1980 and 2008, black people committed 52% of homicides. In 2013, black criminals committed 38% of the murders. Whites accounted for just 31 percent."
 
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